The immigrants over the course of 149 years weren't offloading from the boats with rifles in their hands The vast majority of them faced major discrimination themselves. That's why their descendants (who often are also the descendants of natives) object to such biased portrayals.
Individual people may not be guilty of this, and even major parts of the USA may not have been guilty of it, but as an entity, this is what "the USA" did. If that makes people angry, they should search themselves to see where such anger should be directed.
> I see no "excuse" of American sins, only a response to a tirade which makes very targeted and laughable statements like "unlimited slave labour and IP from Europe". Okay. I can see you are passionate about this but you need to calm down. The guy offered his opinion. It wasn't a tirade. > Who established the Atlantic slave trade if not Europeans? Sure. And britain was the largest slave trading nation and they were t…
Sorry, I just have a real problem with ignorant hatred and prejudice, which this thread is dripping with. Just because they don't use words like dick doesn't mean they aren't using vulgar ad hominems. The mistake is believing that people can distort history but as long as they're being nice about it, it's cool. The US is no more the beneficiary than any other country, so acting like the US is what it is only because…
You're forgetting the unique differences in geography and demographics of the USA area compared to what the germans, french and russians had to "work" with.
Sorry, I just have a real problem with ignorant hatred and prejudice, which this thread is dripping with. Just because they don't use words like dick doesn't mean they aren't using vulgar ad hominems. The mistake is believing that people can distort history but as long as they're being nice about it, it's cool. The US is no more the beneficiary than any other country, so acting like the US is what it is only because…
You're forgetting the unique differences in geography and demographics of the USA area compared to what the germans, french and russians had to "work" with.
What do they matter? How was Russia's treatment of Siberia and the natives there different than NA?
Argentina is a great place for ranching and certain crops, but it has very little mineral wealth. I would hazard that the two most likely reasons for South America's slow progress are that its colonies were attached to ailing empires, and that a rugged and challenging geography made unification difficult to unimaginable. American history has no analog to the horrific War of Triple Alliance, a historical microcosm of…
Not to mention that Argentina was doing quite well for itself at the onset of the 20th century- unfortunately political instability and other challenges hamstrung it since then. If some rolls of the dice had gone differently, it would be solidly in first place status by now, same as Chile.
That was my main point. Given different political culture and other factors along those lines, southern South America may not have the great resources and land mass that the US did and does, but you can't really write them off for geographical determinism reasons. Were those countries really in a worse position with respect to resources, climate, etc. than, say, Australia?
Imagine playing a game of Civilization, but you start at 1700-AD-level technology, with only tribal natives as a threat, on a massive landmass with oceans on two sides rich in natural resources and you have no immediately threatening enemies.
> If people in this thread were being honest they'd be well aware that this particularly American flaw isn't so specific to the US. Sure. It's probably a human trait. But I'm not japanese or belgian or german so I wouldn't know. But I'm responding to a comment which "excused" our sins and I'm an american so that's why I made the comment. If it is a human trait, so be it. But the fact that you are pointing to the sins…
I see no "excuse" of American sins, only a response to a tirade which makes very targeted and laughable statements like "unlimited slave labour and IP from Europe". Who established the Atlantic slave trade if not Europeans? Only pointing out the sins of others because some dick decided to turn a fun historical thread into smug hate the US thread. Any educated American is aware of this stuff. The most voted response i…
Only pointing out the sins of others because some dick decided to turn a fun historical thread into smug hate the US thread.
You are kind of proving his point.
He made a valid criticism of the US and its people's tendency to excuse their own bad behaviour, while noting that it is likely a common thing across most nations, and you get really defensive and angry because he had the audacity to do so.
That's the American exceptionalism thing we all know and love. You interpret criticism as a smug US hate thread which is fucking ridiculous and only serves to kill any debate.
You're forgetting the unique differences in geography and demographics of the USA area compared to what the germans, french and russians had to "work" with.
What do they matter? How was Russia's treatment of Siberia and the natives there different than NA? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_conquest_of_Siberia
To start with:
annual average temperature about 23 °F vs Average temperature: 55.7°F
Also, completely different time frame and technology standard.
Sibera might have given russia some value, but not remotely on the same scale as north america gave to the USA.
I see no "excuse" of American sins, only a response to a tirade which makes very targeted and laughable statements like "unlimited slave labour and IP from Europe". Who established the Atlantic slave trade if not Europeans? Only pointing out the sins of others because some dick decided to turn a fun historical thread into smug hate the US thread. Any educated American is aware of this stuff. The most voted response i…
Only pointing out the sins of others because some dick decided to turn a fun historical thread into smug hate the US thread. You are kind of proving his point. He made a valid criticism of the US and its people's tendency to excuse their own bad behaviour, while noting that it is likely a common thing across most nations, and you get really defensive and angry because he had the audacity to do so. That's the American…
No, I'm interpreting "criticism" as smug hate because the criticism isn't really related to the article and isn't even accurate.
stolen along with unlimited slave labour and IP from Europe
Exaggerated bullshit.
Using jingoism to spin this into some sort of exceptionalism celebrates the loot and plunder
Where's the jingoism in that article? The thread was a good excuse to get the hate on. If the OP would like to make accurate and measured claims, then we could have a discussion.
What do they matter? How was Russia's treatment of Siberia and the natives there different than NA? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_conquest_of_Siberia
To start with: annual average temperature about 23 °F vs Average temperature: 55.7°F Also, completely different time frame and technology standard. Sibera might have given russia some value, but not remotely on the same scale as north america gave to the USA.
So your argument is that because the Russians stole lots of cold land, full of natural resources, that explains their shortcomings relative to the US?
Could there be other things at play, like absolute autocracy dominating the Russian state even today? The Germans had plenty of space and resources had they not lost it trying to dominate their neighbors.
Only pointing out the sins of others because some dick decided to turn a fun historical thread into smug hate the US thread. You are kind of proving his point. He made a valid criticism of the US and its people's tendency to excuse their own bad behaviour, while noting that it is likely a common thing across most nations, and you get really defensive and angry because he had the audacity to do so. That's the American…
No, I'm interpreting "criticism" as smug hate because the criticism isn't really related to the article and isn't even accurate. stolen along with unlimited slave labour and IP from Europe Exaggerated bullshit. Using jingoism to spin this into some sort of exceptionalism celebrates the loot and plunder Where's the jingoism in that article? The thread was a good excuse to get the hate on. If the OP would like to make…
I'm not talking about the article, I'm talking about your overreaction.