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Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

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Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#201

Post by cookiecaper »

downandout wrote: post #195
cookiecaper wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely correct. Zuckerberg lucked into Facebook after stealing the concept from a client. Zuck's self-esteem would be destroyed if he had this same honest evaluation of himself, so he has to tell himself that he made it due to his unusually high work ethic, intelligence, or other personal traits.

Probably the biggest thing I've learned through hard experience is that great ideas by themselves have very little value. At this point it's irrelevant whether he copied the idea from his client(s), or from Friendster or MySpace. Out of pure luck, Zuck's version appealed to the masses enough to get them to register for the site and use the contact importer. After that, skill took over - Zuck knew that if a high enoug…

I totally agree. Innovation is not necessarily valued by the market. There is no shame in seeing what others are doing and copying it -- that's how the free market is supposed to work. The competition is good for everyone, and indeed, analyzing what's working and what's not for your predecessors and competitors can often be instructive in developing something that can eventually conquer the world, which Facebook assuredly did. 100% on board with execution being many orders of magnitude more important than the germinating idea.

However, the Winklevoss twins had hired Zuck and communicated their proprietary information so that they could get his execution. It is absolutely shady to get hired to develop a product, chicken out, and then implement your own version using your client's intellectual property. It's obvious that Zuck was in hot water here; if he wasn't, he wouldn't have paid out to the Winklevoss's.

It appears the lesson from Zuck is "take whatever you can and win, then deal with any potential consequences from a position of strength".

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#202

Post by argonaut »

oskarth wrote: post #149
jseliger wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For all the flack that Zuck is getting in this thread It's pretty safe to ignore most of the flack in this thread. Most people vote with their feet (or wallets, or eyeballs, or attention), and they've voted that they love Facebook, regardless of what a minority of people in this thread say or upvote. Nerds have a cantankerous side and are as prone to virtue signalling as any other group. Those of us who read Slashdot…

> Most people vote with their feet (or wallets, or eyeballs, or attention), and they've voted that they love Facebook, regardless of what a minority of people in this thread say or upvote. Plenty of people in the HN demographic also vote with their feet by quitting FB.

The HN demographic is minuscule.

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#203

Post by [deleted] »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #196
gavinpc wrote: post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's a difference between loving Facebook, and begrudgingly using it because that's where my friends/family are. Not to Facebook.

Even to Facebook. Coercion - even subtle social coercion - only works up to a point. If you piss off people enough they'll reward you with zero loyalty, no matter how popular you think you are. FB is vulnerable unless it keeps its users very happy. Currently it has a monopoly on a product that's actually quite mediocre and frustrating in many ways, and not seen as particularly cool. If it has to face real competition…

[deleted]

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#204

Post by shklnrj »

qaq wrote: post #183
shklnrj wrote: post #84

Is someone else surprised that Peter Thiel invested in Facebook when it had 100000 users and Mark Zuckerberg said that he planned to go back to college? What are the chances of that happening with a product today?

Today people get an order of magnitude bigger rounds with 0 users :)

Hmm...that can happen, but does that happen for a 19 year old college guy? That happens today but mostly with experienced founders.

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#205

Post by erintumeran »

ItsMattyG wrote: post #171
JamesBarney wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Donating to a http://www.givewell.org/ recommended charity is probably a more scalable way to make the world a better place.

I suspect it's probably a wash. Donating to a Givewell charity has less risk certainly, but a successful startup on the order of Facebook will change the world by multiple orders of magnitude more. The expected value is probably similar.

People overestimate the positive impact of technology. Of course in Silicon Valley you're considered crazy if you don't believe technology solves everything. But it's not as simple as that. My grandparents for example, had no internet, no Facebook, no iPhones. They're doing great and have led very fulfilling lives. Most of the positivity in their lives came from their relationship with each other and their kids. Of course they are only one example, and that is not a lot of data. But we know that there are millions of people in Silicon Valley right now who have the fastest internet, the most amazing social media apps, they are young and can take advantage of all the modern technology in existence, and yet they might feel isolated and be totally depressed in their lives.

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#206

Post by greysphere »

dang wrote: post #120
thefastlane wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

power and privilege help too.

That they do, but the problem with taking the conversation in this direction is that it gets us all thinking in terms of how some people have had it easier, instead of what we can do that's valuable of our own.

It also challenges people to think how to structure a society that maximizes peoples ability to work at this level. The folks who figure out how to put 'everyone' in a position to make successful startups with have contributed orders of magnitude more value to society than any single startup.

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#207

Post by tedmiston »

beambot wrote: post #151
jomamaxx wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a lot of luck in Facebook, even if Zuck is a particularly talented individual. Also - if Harvard is a great school - how the F does someone find time to do the work and make a product at the same time? When I did Engineering, I didn't have time to take a shower.

Pareto principle applied to homework, study, and grades. I spent way too much time worrying about grades. I'm not sure it mattered. It would have been just as good (and probably more enjoyable) to be a B-student with awesome side projects rather than an A-student with none. (And often, esp. for college, one doesn't even need to make that trade-off when homework is largely immaterial, and your grade only depends on ex…

I feel like everyone thinks this way in retrospect, but at the time it's so much harder. It's hard to accept not being at the top of everything even when you know they're just local maxima.

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#208

Post by an_ko »

erintumeran wrote: post #205
ItsMattyG wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect it's probably a wash. Donating to a Givewell charity has less risk certainly, but a successful startup on the order of Facebook will change the world by multiple orders of magnitude more. The expected value is probably similar.

People overestimate the positive impact of technology. Of course in Silicon Valley you're considered crazy if you don't believe technology solves everything. But it's not as simple as that. My grandparents for example, had no internet, no Facebook, no iPhones. They're doing great and have led very fulfilling lives. Most of the positivity in their lives came from their relationship with each other and their kids. Of c…

It comes down to definitions. What is "positive impact" to you? To me, it means "increasing the total amount of human understanding", not "making everybod happy and Amish".

Edit: By the way, this is the essential difference between Bentham's and Mill's versions of utilitarian philosophy, if you'd like to research further. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stuart_Mill#Utilitarianis...

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#209

Post by ItsMattyG »

erintumeran wrote: post #205
ItsMattyG wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect it's probably a wash. Donating to a Givewell charity has less risk certainly, but a successful startup on the order of Facebook will change the world by multiple orders of magnitude more. The expected value is probably similar.

People overestimate the positive impact of technology. Of course in Silicon Valley you're considered crazy if you don't believe technology solves everything. But it's not as simple as that. My grandparents for example, had no internet, no Facebook, no iPhones. They're doing great and have led very fulfilling lives. Most of the positivity in their lives came from their relationship with each other and their kids. Of c…

>People overestimate the positive impact of technology. Of course in Silicon Valley you're considered crazy if you don't believe technology solves everything. But it's not as simple as that. My grandparents for example, had no internet, no Facebook, no iPhones. They're doing great and have led very fulfilling lives. Most of the positivity in their lives came from their relationship with each other and their kids. Of course they are only one example, and that is not a lot of data. But we know that there are millions of people in Silicon Valley right now who have the fastest internet, the most amazing social media apps, they are young and can take advantage of all the modern technology in existence, and yet they might feel isolated and be totally depressed in their lives.

I mean, technology is probably not going to make rich people's lives better at this point unless it removes some substantial annoyance. I suspect that like money, there's diminishing returns after a certain point.

But, for someone who has never had internet before, to get connected (one of Mark's three stated goals in the video) is life changing.

Re: Sam Altman talks with Mark Zuckerberg about how to build the future [video]

#210

Post by ItsMattyG »

metaphorm wrote: post #173
ItsMattyG wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same reasoning can be applied to be people like Jack Dorsey, Peter Thiel, Elon Musk who have made several billion dollar companies.

can it? explain.

The fact that they were able to replicate their success multiple times, just like Einstein, and that they're all smart, just like Einstein, says that there's probably some aspect of talent involved in their success.

If it was purely based on luck, without any talent involved, you'd expect billion dollar companies to be more evenly distributed, and not cluster among certain individuals.

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