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Xamarin Open-Sourced

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Re: Xamarin Open-Sourced

#201

Post by osweiller »

tacos wrote: post #200
osweiller wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point I have to assume you're trolling. No one is this obtuse. Xamarin is a company, not a product Xamarin the company has a primary anchor product that is a tooling and SDK to build cross platform apps (indeed, on Xamarin.com it is literally the only non-service product. There is zero ambiguity). To anyone not autistic, that is clearly the focus on this entire discussion. Your bizarre incantation of Unity us…

> on Xamarin.com it is literally the only non-service product > Microsoft made it completely free. Yawn.. Microsoft open sources the entire SDK. Yawn. After your nap, click the "All Products" link. You'll see other products -- and 26 pages of components.

"All products" list four items, one of which is a product , three of which are services. Exactly as I already said.

Give it up. Your initial comment about Mono was ridiculous and grotesquely out of context, and you've just continued this bizarre obnoxiously.

And the most ridiculous part of all is that this very submission, and Xamarin's own terminology, calls their app development stack "Xamarin".

No one is confused but you.

Re: Xamarin Open-Sourced

#202

Post by Merad »

osweiller wrote: post #191
tacos wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Compromised" how? "Leaky abstraction"? What is the abstraction and can you please provide specific examples of the leak? It worked between Mac and Windows on very complicated apps. It bridged Linux and Windows for tweaky MVC stacks a decade ago (then they wisely sharpened their focus.) It got the job done pumping data through hardcore game engines. The network stack is proven robust. You're talking about it like it'…

You're talking about it like it's some stupid ORM wrapper or wonky Widget UI library. It is not. Again, this conversation is about Xamarin the mobile app studio. There is zero ambiguity in this, so it is perplexing that you keep bringing this up. https://www.xamarin.com/ The context is the cross-platform app creation toolset. It generates extremely poor quality code, usually at a significantly increased development t…

You don't seem to understand how Xamarin works at all. The entire point is that you have the ability to share code, but also to drop to platform specific code at any time. The absolute worst case should be that you build totally different UI code for each platform while most of your business logic can sit in shared code. If you do target their cross platform UI framework (Xamarin.Forms) then all or large chunks of of your UI are in shared code, but even then you can write things like platform specific renderers to tweak your controls to the platform.

Re: Xamarin Open-Sourced

#203

Post by osweiller »

Merad wrote: post #202
osweiller wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're talking about it like it's some stupid ORM wrapper or wonky Widget UI library. It is not. Again, this conversation is about Xamarin the mobile app studio. There is zero ambiguity in this, so it is perplexing that you keep bringing this up. https://www.xamarin.com/ The context is the cross-platform app creation toolset. It generates extremely poor quality code, usually at a significantly increased development t…

You don't seem to understand how Xamarin works at all. The entire point is that you have the ability to share code, but also to drop to platform specific code at any time. The absolute worst case should be that you build totally different UI code for each platform while most of your business logic can sit in shared code. If you do target their cross platform UI framework (Xamarin.Forms) then all or large chunks of of…

You just described exactly what I described in various other posts. How you came to the conclusion that I "don't seem to understand" can only possibly be due to some sort of zealot blindness that makes you a defender.

Best case -- terrible abstraction. Worst case -- you're rewriting much of your code for each platform, working on a 3rd party incomplete abstraction that is always behind and full of unnecessary layered surprises.

What a win!

And for the next bizarre Xamarin sponsor that decides to wallow in and throw up this -- I worked on a large scale solution with Xamarin. We threw it out and just went with separate projects for each platform, sharing code with C++. Works wonders. Way better than Xamarin.

Re: Xamarin Open-Sourced

#205

Post by tacos »

osweiller wrote: post #201
tacos wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> on Xamarin.com it is literally the only non-service product > Microsoft made it completely free. Yawn.. Microsoft open sources the entire SDK. Yawn. After your nap, click the "All Products" link. You'll see other products -- and 26 pages of components.

"All products" list four items, one of which is a product , three of which are services. Exactly as I already said . Give it up. Your initial comment about Mono was ridiculous and grotesquely out of context, and you've just continued this bizarre obnoxiously. And the most ridiculous part of all is that this very submission, and Xamarin's own terminology, calls their app development stack "Xamarin". No one is confused…

> "All products" list four items, one of which is a product

The Products menu has a fifth menu item, All Products. It will show you additional products.

Apparently you are not familiar with the (bumpy!) history of Xamarin's technology. Now that it's open source, you can actually trace lines of code from Xamarin Platform and Xamarin Forms and the Xamarin Profiler back to the early Mono and Unity days. They were a small team that bit off way more than they can chew, delivered more than seems possible even today, and gradually tightened their focus to mobile.

Now they are open source and have Microsoft fully behind them. I wasted a ton of time and money and performance running under Mono on Linux when I should've just used Windows server. But I got it back using Xamarin Platform on two recent large-scale mobile development efforts.

You win some, you lose some, and eventually you develop the maturity not to claim an entire industry had the same exact failures you did to make yourself feel better. Good luck.

Re: Xamarin Open-Sourced

#206

Post by chris_wot »

osweiller wrote: post #199
tacos wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Xamarin is a company, not a product. Mono is a Microsoft-sponsored project. If you can't be bothered to get that right it makes it even harder to accept you speaking on behalf of the entire industry. > "this open sourcing has been met with a universal yawn" It happened 18 hours ago! Do you think the kinds of companies that code in C# even noticed yet?

At this point I have to assume you're trolling. No one is this obtuse. Xamarin is a company, not a product Xamarin the company has a primary anchor product that is a tooling and SDK to build cross platform apps (indeed, on Xamarin.com it is literally the only non-service product. There is zero ambiguity). To anyone not autistic, that is clearly the focus on this entire discussion. Your bizarre incantation of Unity us…

Please stop accusing others of being trolls.
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