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SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

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Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#201

Post by knowaveragejoe »

zepto wrote: post #170
ctlby wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The city spends $167 million [1] for a homeless population no larger than 15,000 (and probably closer to 7,000) [2]. The wealthy city isn't leaving anyone to his or her fate. To the contrary, it's expending vast amounts of wealth with precious little to show for it. [1] http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/matier-ross/article/S-F-spendi... [2] https://sfgov.org/lhcb/sites/sfgov.org.lhcb/files/2015%20San...

That's between 12k and 20k per person. Way less than you'd need to provide accommodation and treatment for a person with mental illness. It's not surprising it doesn't work.

The people blasting the city claim the city isn't doing enough, and when shown that they are actually are providing a remarkable amount of support, it still isn't enough. 12-20k annually is more than a significant chunk of the population earns in wages.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#202

Post by ryanlol »

jimmytucson wrote: post #149
Afforess wrote: post #9

To play devil's advocate, he's right. He shouldn't have to see the pain, struggle, and despair of homeless - the city government should be providing affordable housing and shelters for the homeless. That it hasn't is a failure of the local government, and should be addressed. Much of the reason that affordable housing is out of reach of many in San Francisco is due to government regulation, not market capitalism. Ext…

> To play devil's advocate, he's right. You're not really agreeing with him though, are you? He's saying homeless people are an eyesore. You're saying the government should create more homeless shelters. I don't think you guys are even on the same planet in terms of your views.

He's saying homeless people are an eyesore and trashing the city, that's unquestionably true.

He's also saying the government should fix it, what other options are there but homeless shelters?

I don't get why people are acting like this guy wants to send the homeless to concentration camps and gas them.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#203

Post by mdellavo »

mikeash wrote: post #40

Holy shit. I saw the quote in the headline and thought, that is some seriously unfortunate wording. I get what they mean, but putting it in the first person like that makes it sound like the problem is the seeing, not the pain, struggle, etc. Then I read the actual letter. It's not unfortunate wording! They actually intend to say that the problem is the seeing! This person doesn't care in the least about these people…

The author also seems very out of touch and sheltered to the realities of living in a city.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#204

Post by kifler »

lintiness wrote: post #165
themartorana wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's great, then. It seems like a liberal calling card but appeals to everyone's desire to save money while providing actually useful social services. So what's the political argument against it?

political arguments against anything these days are emotional reactions to parties and politicians rather than policy. people need to turn off the cable news and live less angry lives.

I think most people would argue that they had to pay for their housing but here we have people getting it for free.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#205

Post by blackrose »

cloverich wrote: post #119
maratd wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does every comment on here need to be cited? Nobody is writing a research paper through HN comments. We're just having a conversation.

Because personal accounts are only generalizable when backed by additional sources / data. There's a difference between whether or not this person is being genuine (My bias is yes) and whether or not their accounts are generalizable (My bias is no). Asking for citations is to me a way of asking someone who seems already familiar with what they are describing for more information, so I can learn more / share with othe…

He was obviously being anecdotal. Asking for a citation on it is like asking for a professional food critic's review on a cheeseburger that your friend just ate and said was "really good." It's pedantic and condescending when OP obviously has some experience with the situation based on their profession.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#206

Post by kelukelugames »

ryandrake wrote: post #39
FussyZeus wrote: post #4

I wonder if this was s stunt to get attention on his company? This seems so cartoonish, I mean you could picture wealthy people thinking this way but to me it almost seems too insensitive. Maybe a publicity stunt that backfired a little. On the other hand maybe he is so sheltered as to think this is an actual problem he's helping solve...

Having read the letter, I can't help but think that this must be some kind of elaborate trolling: That after 2 weeks or so, he'll follow-up with "Thanks for all the attention everyone! My start-up's revenue took a 45% bump from all this publicity!!" This reads like a cartoon caricature of the stereotypical clueless tech bro. No real person could actually think this way.

Read HN threads about gender and race issues. People fit all of the stereotypes.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#207

Post by beatpanda »

Shivetya wrote: post #183
Afforess wrote: post #9

To play devil's advocate, he's right. He shouldn't have to see the pain, struggle, and despair of homeless - the city government should be providing affordable housing and shelters for the homeless. That it hasn't is a failure of the local government, and should be addressed. Much of the reason that affordable housing is out of reach of many in San Francisco is due to government regulation, not market capitalism. Ext…

Every consider that both the climate and the abundance of social programs could be exaggerating SF homeless issue for many? Simply put, its a good place to go and this word gets around. In other words, its good having such support systems but residents must understand that for that all people gravitate to cities that meet their needs. Techies and the like want the climate, the history, and high tech goods and service…

Yes, people often consider that, and then they look at the data:

http://sfgov.org/lhcb/sites/sfgov.org.lhcb/files/2015%20San%...

70% of homeless people in San Francisco were housed residents of San Francisco before the became homeless, and most of the remaining 30% were in a city adjacent to San Francisco before coming to SF after becoming homeless.

Also, the idea that social services are "widely available" to homless people in San Francisco is a farce. For example, there is only 1 available shelter bed for every 5 homeless people.

Source: I worked as a service provider for homeless people in SF and I've seen our supposed "generous benefits" up close.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#208

Post by ZeroGravitas »

kauffj wrote: post #55

It's ironic that Keller will get so much shit dumped on him for making the same exact argument that people make against more permissive immigration. Compare: A : Allowing people trapped in unproductive countries to move to US/Canada/Europe would significantly improve their quality of life. B : But think of burden to the welfare state! We wouldn't be able to afford the flood of people moving here for benefits. A : Sim…

I have a theory that "left" and "right" can be replaced with how a big a circle of humanity you care about.

The people towards the right care about their family, or their community. The people on the left care about a slightly wider circle.

On the far "right" you get sociopaths that only care about themselves. On the far "left" you get utopian hippies that care about people suffering on the other side of the world.

What this frame of reference shows is how close together the traditional left-right are in a wider view. Someone who wants to tax the rich to help the poor doesn't often mean using money from Americans to help Mexicans or Ethiopians, they mean taxing rich Americans to give to the sligthly less rich Americans.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#209

Post by BinaryIdiot »

basseq wrote: post #137
Coding_Cat wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>You can't force them to use detox clinics, etc. Maybe it is not possible yet legally, but why shouldn't we allow this? The courts can already force people to be commited for mental afflictions when they are a danger to themselves or others. Why not do the same for (heavy) drug addicts who start becoming a liability?

Especially considering the alternative is forced incarceration. Mandatory treatment at least focuses on improvement.

Mandatory treatment can also mean forced incarceration though. It's hard to get out of a mental hospital if the government picked you up and put you there.

Not saying I know the answer though.

Re: SF tech bro: ‘I shouldn’t have to see the pain, struggle, despair of homeless’

#210

Post by gsibble »

erroneousfunk wrote: post #103

So this guy went to school, worked hard, and now makes enough money to pay rent and feed himself in one of the most expensive cities in the US. small golf clap His main fault here is assuming that this also means, while ironically citing free market economics, that he's rich enough to have some sort of right not to see homelessness, mental illness, and poverty, day to day. That's a whole other level of wealth and pow…

Most cities don't have nearly the homeless/drug problem that SF has. It's abysmal here.
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