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Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

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Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#21

Post by tptacek »

run4yourlives wrote: post #16
tptacek wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably the only opening I know of for negotiating "normal" stuff is, "how much of a discount would we get for a long-term commitment, say, a year up front".

But in this case, you've already sequestered yourself into a one year commitment, and the other person has conceded nothing. If I know you're available to commit, I just need to find your discount level. You're going to underestimate my acquisition costs, I can guarantee that. Better to suggest: "I really like your product here, but to be frank, I've got to watch my money right now. Is there a way you can reduce this…

You're right, of course, but a lot of people who aren't flexible on price are flexible on payment or delivery terms, so I guess I'm just saying pull whatever levers you can find.

But this is an example of how much I suck at day to day negotiation.

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#23

Post by chris100 »

jbond wrote: post #14

I, too, negotiate everything. You would be surprised at how much wiggle room there is at a national retailer like Best Buy for big-ticket items. Here are some ground rules and the steps I use to haggle: Haggling works better if you can pay in cash. Know how much you are willing to spend and do not exceed it! Never, ever reveal to the salesperson how much you are willing to spend. 1. Express a casual and not too focus…

Internet prices and retail is actually something I have been thinking about recently. Someone, please help me with the economics.

What if a retail store offered great advice and let you order online so you get the best Internet price?

One reason why I almost never visit a retail store anymore is because the best deal is always online.

So rather than take it as a challenge for retail, embrace it. Can one build a retail business that relies on ordering stuff from the cheapest online retailers?

I can think of the obvious reasons why not. But if you think creatively, wouldn't that make sense? Even the cheapest online retailers offer some kind of referral compensation. There may be other ways to make money than making a profit on the big ticket item that your visitor came in to order...

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#24

Post by chris100 »

raju wrote: post #4
tptacek wrote: post #3

This is awesome. I'd love a small conversation thread about how to find openings to negotiate things; I'm getting adequate at negotiating when negotiation is expected (like in professional services), but I suck everywhere else.

Negotiate everything - Agreed. Would the OP have any tips on how one would know how to approach this? Pointers to books/articles welcome.

One way that taught me a lot. Go to a third world country and just for fun, negotiate retail items (baseball cap, tshirt, whatever). Shoot for 80% off. Can you do it? Then go for 90% off...

You'll quickly learn that you have two weapons: money in your pocket that the other guy wants, and the ability to walk away if you don't like the deal.

Everything else is fluff.

PS: another way to practice is go through timeshare presentations. Keep saying no. You'll be amazed how low the prices can get. You'll be handled by 2,3 or 4 different sales people, each with supposedly more authority and better deals to offer you. Keep saying no. You'll see :-)

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#25

Post by notauser »

chris100 wrote: post #23
jbond wrote: post #14

I, too, negotiate everything. You would be surprised at how much wiggle room there is at a national retailer like Best Buy for big-ticket items. Here are some ground rules and the steps I use to haggle: Haggling works better if you can pay in cash. Know how much you are willing to spend and do not exceed it! Never, ever reveal to the salesperson how much you are willing to spend. 1. Express a casual and not too focus…

Internet prices and retail is actually something I have been thinking about recently. Someone, please help me with the economics. What if a retail store offered great advice and let you order online so you get the best Internet price? One reason why I almost never visit a retail store anymore is because the best deal is always online. So rather than take it as a challenge for retail, embrace it. Can one build a retai…

Amazon affiliate revenues go up to 9%. I'm sure you could negotiate something similar with other providers.

Possibly you could offer people an guided Internet shopping experience in the mall - people come in and, with the help of an 'Internet shopping expert', buy things at Internet prices for later delivery. As you suggest you could monetize by collecting the affiliate commission.

If running a kiosk in a small mall cost you $20,000 a month (?) you would need to persuade people to buy ~1,000 $200 TVs a month.

The biggest barrier I can see would be overcoming the hostility from the other stores who would be really keen to kick you out once they spotted what you were doing. Because they occupy more square feet I'm sure mall management would oblige.

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#26

Post by arnorhs »

unohoo wrote: post #5

== 2. Negotiate everything == I've found this to be a very much cultural thing. Bargaining / haggling is quite common in Asian cultures. Since I'm originally from India, I initially was surprised to find that haggling is not an acceptable thing in the american society. That hasnt stopped me from my efforts at haggling one bit. My latest conquest - a free shield and case for my iphone when bestbuy made me wait for abo…

Heh, I can imagine that it must have been a shock! I've been traveling through India for the last few months and at first I had a really hard time haggling.

Westerners feel guilty and have all kinds of emotions fixed to this process, while it's commonplace in India. I think Indians have a big advantage in that aspect.

BTW: I love your country and GJ on the shield case :)

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#27

Post by jbond »

chris100 wrote: post #23
jbond wrote: post #14

I, too, negotiate everything. You would be surprised at how much wiggle room there is at a national retailer like Best Buy for big-ticket items. Here are some ground rules and the steps I use to haggle: Haggling works better if you can pay in cash. Know how much you are willing to spend and do not exceed it! Never, ever reveal to the salesperson how much you are willing to spend. 1. Express a casual and not too focus…

Internet prices and retail is actually something I have been thinking about recently. Someone, please help me with the economics. What if a retail store offered great advice and let you order online so you get the best Internet price? One reason why I almost never visit a retail store anymore is because the best deal is always online. So rather than take it as a challenge for retail, embrace it. Can one build a retai…

What you would need to do is start a retail store that either:

A) Sold the product at a price competitive to the online retailers (competitive can mean price or value-add services like knowledgeable salespeople, free delivery, etc.)

or

B) Provided great advice, directed a customer to the cheapest internet price and then had a value-add service. The store would then get paid via the internet store from which the item was purchased. The problem with this approach is that after time it would be beneficial (in the short term) for the retail store to direct customers to whichever online store gave the retail store the best kick back.

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#28

Post by jimbokun »

chris100 wrote: post #24
raju wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Negotiate everything - Agreed. Would the OP have any tips on how one would know how to approach this? Pointers to books/articles welcome.

One way that taught me a lot. Go to a third world country and just for fun, negotiate retail items (baseball cap, tshirt, whatever). Shoot for 80% off. Can you do it? Then go for 90% off... You'll quickly learn that you have two weapons: money in your pocket that the other guy wants, and the ability to walk away if you don't like the deal. Everything else is fluff. PS: another way to practice is go through timeshare…

In Manhattan's Chinatown, my wife would sometimes pick up an item and lay down the cash she thought it was worth (lower than the listed price, of course).

They never wanted her to pick that money back up again.

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#29

Post by chris100 »

notauser wrote: post #25
chris100 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Internet prices and retail is actually something I have been thinking about recently. Someone, please help me with the economics. What if a retail store offered great advice and let you order online so you get the best Internet price? One reason why I almost never visit a retail store anymore is because the best deal is always online. So rather than take it as a challenge for retail, embrace it. Can one build a retai…

Amazon affiliate revenues go up to 9%. I'm sure you could negotiate something similar with other providers. Possibly you could offer people an guided Internet shopping experience in the mall - people come in and, with the help of an 'Internet shopping expert', buy things at Internet prices for later delivery. As you suggest you could monetize by collecting the affiliate commission. If running a kiosk in a small mall…

The biggest barrier I can see would be overcoming the hostility from the other stores

If that's the only problem, you could just open your retail store outside a mall, where no one can bother you.

Think El Camino in Silicon Valley. If you have the best value (unbeatable price and good service), you should have a winner, right?

Re: Tell HN: Four (hopefully) unique and useful start-up tips

#30

Post by btilly »

tptacek wrote: post #3

This is awesome. I'd love a small conversation thread about how to find openings to negotiate things; I'm getting adequate at negotiating when negotiation is expected (like in professional services), but I suck everywhere else.

Here is a simple example.

You know at an amusement park how they take your picture, print it out, then try to sell it to you at a ridiculous price? I have a friend who always says, "So what do you do if I don't buy, just throw it out?" "Yes." "I'll give you $5 for it."

He says that if he gets the owner he usually gets the photo for that. If he gets the employee he usually doesn't.

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