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By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

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Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#21

Post by thirdtruck »

xianshou wrote: post #10

I play Go and chess, and I think of it this way: the best players may have won more than others, but they have also lost more than others, because they have simply played more games. Frequent loss or rejection is a necessary step to goodness. This also applies to business, the opposite sex, and most anything else that might matter to you. Or, to paraphrase many an artist and CEO: if I have not failed today, it means…

I just finished Waitzkin's The Art of Learning, which discusses exactly that.

He makes the point that (IIRC) Michael Jordan made more last-minute, game-winning throws than anyone else on his team, but he also missed the most game-losing ones. He only excelled by overreaching.

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#22

Post by thirdtruck »

pmelendez wrote: post #13
phatfish wrote: post #7

If my wife had divorced me and i ended up a crying heap on the floor like this guy i would probably want to try this. Most people are not in that situation though, it's all relative. Fair play to him though.

I find this to be useful in other situations though, like asking +X% more of rise or in an interview, or asking for a better deal with your internet provider, or just a discount in an store.

Exactly. I'm interviewing with several places now. Even when it doesn't work out, I don't frame that as a "failure" but rather as practice for the next interview. That reframing does wonders for my morale.

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#23

Post by Disruptive_Dave »

thirdtruck wrote: post #21
xianshou wrote: post #10

I play Go and chess, and I think of it this way: the best players may have won more than others, but they have also lost more than others, because they have simply played more games. Frequent loss or rejection is a necessary step to goodness. This also applies to business, the opposite sex, and most anything else that might matter to you. Or, to paraphrase many an artist and CEO: if I have not failed today, it means…

I just finished Waitzkin's The Art of Learning , which discusses exactly that. He makes the point that (IIRC) Michael Jordan made more last-minute, game-winning throws than anyone else on his team, but he also missed the most game-losing ones. He only excelled by overreaching.

http://georgelugojr.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/michael-j...

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#24

Post by semperfaux »

jonpress wrote: post #19

I didn't have many friends in school. I never tried to fit in - I found other people in my class to be predictable and uninteresting and it took me too much energy to pretend that I was enjoying their company. I went through several years of school with no friends at all - At times, 'cool' kids would invite me to play sports with them after school but I never did. I spent all my lunch breaks alone programming games o…

I have no intention of questioning your choices, but I think you may be mistaking communing with others as some sort of easy way out. Personally, I find it pretty hard, so perhaps it'd be worth your time to try more real, deep interaction with people you don't know. It can be a serious challenge, and while having no fear of rejection is perhaps ideal, I don't think I would call intentional introversion the most difficult possible life decision.

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#25

Post by Lavery »

brazzy wrote: post #14
SeanDav wrote: post #8

As a teenager I went to an all boys school, so was very shy with women. One day I just decided to get over my fear and resolved to ask for the telephone number of every pretty girl that caught my attention in public, even if they were with other girls. Importantly to the process was that it was never my intention to actually call the girl - just to see what percentage gave me their number. Since the outcome was not i…

The question is how many of those 25% were fake numbers "just to get that creeper off my back". It's nice that you decided to "not be creepy", but it's not you who decides how your behaviour is judged.

Sure, and obviously it's not good to make people uncomfortable. But from his perspective he wouldn't care whether the numbers were fake.

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#26

Post by fenomas »

bitL wrote: post #15

He could accelerate his progress if he just did 50 cold calls to random strangers selling diapers a day - he would be super hardened after a week ;-)

Which raises an interesting question - do people with such jobs deal exceptionally well with rejection?

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that they do, but then I wouldn't be if they were more than averagely depressed, either.

Surely someone must have looked into this.

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#27

Post by semperfaux »

thirdtruck wrote: post #17
brazzy wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The question is how many of those 25% were fake numbers "just to get that creeper off my back". It's nice that you decided to "not be creepy", but it's not you who decides how your behaviour is judged.

That's a bit (I admit not entirely) like saying that "Maybe all those free-throws you practiced between games didn't score us any actual points." 100% of the women he didn't ask did not give him his number. The exercise served the purpose of pushing him past the fear that would have otherwise paralyzed him during a real request.

Not really at all. The analogy is entirely wrong.

Yes, the exercise anecdotally served the purpose of improving his confidence. But no, your assumption that he would be unable to ask for a number he really wanted is unfounded and has nothing to do with your false analogy.

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#28

Post by thirdtruck »

Disruptive_Dave wrote: post #23
thirdtruck wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just finished Waitzkin's The Art of Learning , which discusses exactly that. He makes the point that (IIRC) Michael Jordan made more last-minute, game-winning throws than anyone else on his team, but he also missed the most game-losing ones. He only excelled by overreaching.

http://georgelugojr.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/michael-j...

Thanks!

Re: By Making a Game Out of Rejection, a Man Conquers Fear

#29

Post by balabaster »

jonpress wrote: post #19

I didn't have many friends in school. I never tried to fit in - I found other people in my class to be predictable and uninteresting and it took me too much energy to pretend that I was enjoying their company. I went through several years of school with no friends at all - At times, 'cool' kids would invite me to play sports with them after school but I never did. I spent all my lunch breaks alone programming games o…

If you like a challenge, why did you fold from the challenge of enjoying a sense of community with those that appear uninteresting to you? Everyone has something to learn and something to teach. I bet if you'd stuck it out, there was much you could have learned from them, and them from you. Closing yourself off in a room robs both you and them from a chance to grow.
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