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Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

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Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#21

Post by jacobolus »

iribe wrote: post #16

I wonder if this lack of being able to set / keep goals correlates to math which often involves goal setting then working backwards to find the right steps to reach a solution. Are procrastinators worse at math?

Anecdotally: I’m one of the worst procrastinators I know, and also one of the best mathematical problem solvers. Some of the most organized and diligent people I know are terrible at logical/mathematical reasoning.

I don’t think there’s a strong relationship. If anything, mathematical problem solving requires a lot of drifting around in the problem space and doodling that can be difficult for someone who approaches work/problem solving in a start-working-now-and-work-until-it’s-done kind of way.

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#22

Post by _delirium »

tokenadult wrote: post #4
ChrisNorstrom wrote: post #3

Little by little the evidence is starting to show that people's problems aren't always a system, a government, an ideology, or another group of people, but rather themselves. Hopefully one day "blame culture" can be ended altogether.

Do you think we are done with the natural experiment of people moving into places with different systems or different cultures and finding out their own prospects, or the prospects of their children, change?

You don't even necessarily have to move to find that, just move in time (granted, past a certain number of years that becomes impractical, given lifespans). It's particularly striking here in Scandinavia, which has had relatively stable genetics over an extended period, yet extremely variable societies resulting, with different traits rewarded or discouraged at different times. It was (to generalize) once a warrior culture, then a hierarchical aristocratic culture, and is now a peaceful egalitarian culture, all with roughly the same genes involved.

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#23

Post by programmarchy »

sah88 wrote: post #10
Xcelerate wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting point, and brings up a kind of weird philosophical issue I've often wondered about. Suppose that genetically, someone is predisposed to have very high motivation and discipline. Born into whatever environment, they have the aptitude to improving their life. Now imagine someone who, genetically, is predisposed to very low motivation and discipline. Born into a poor, or low-class environment, the…

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." One of the oldest questions in philosophy to which I don't think there has every really been a good answer. Or at least I haven't read one.

Great quote by Schopenhauer. An analogy of the will that I like is that the will is like an animal in that the drive to live and reproduce is primal. But this animal -- let's call it a donkey -- can be tamed and then ridden upon, and with proper discipline, be made to go where the rider -- or intellect --wants it to go.

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#24

Post by jrapdx3 »

As a clinician not surprising that procrastination, impulsivity and poor goal-direction could be genetically linked. Combinations of such behavioral attributes (along with other manifestations) are associated with certain behavioral disorders, for example, these behaviors are common among adults with attentional disorders.

Of course, just having those traits is not sufficient to establish any specific diagnosis. Digesting the article more thoroughly will take me some time. However, it does seem to show these traits appear to have common genetic roots, but the traits also cut across nominal diagnostic categories.

That last point has merit. Behavior has to be considered along with its complex context in order to determine the significance of the behavior. It's difficult to figure out connections among the many contextual variables, far too many to glean quickly. "Explanations" whether applied to self or others bear risk of being wrong.

OTOH, procrastination or impulsive action may have non-trivial consequences. If these really are causing problems finding solutions is imperative. If self-help doesn't solve it, seek professional help. Most places, it's not hard to find, and it can make a big difference. If you need it, go get it.

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#25

Post by cottonseed »

mindvirus wrote: post #7

A little bit off topic: Setting goals is something that I'm pretty bad at - at work, I set obvious goals like "finish project X by Y.", but other than that, I have a hard time setting goals in my life. I have some higher level goals - eat healthy, exercise, read a technical book every quarter, but barely anything approaching SMART goals. Because of this, I feel like I lack ambition sometimes. How do you identify goal…

Make a timeline for the next 10 years. Where are you trying to go? What are you doing to get there? Try to be specific about your plans and actions and how they will realize your goals. This is not an easy exercise. Making a timeline of your past can be helpful for getting perspective. I'm relatively planful, but I have trouble planning more than about 3-5 years out, although a few times I've had pretty clear 8 year plans (some of which actually came to pass). A friend with ADHD got this exercise from his therapist. I think this is a great exercise for anyone.

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#26

Post by cottonseed »

sah88 wrote: post #10
Xcelerate wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting point, and brings up a kind of weird philosophical issue I've often wondered about. Suppose that genetically, someone is predisposed to have very high motivation and discipline. Born into whatever environment, they have the aptitude to improving their life. Now imagine someone who, genetically, is predisposed to very low motivation and discipline. Born into a poor, or low-class environment, the…

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." One of the oldest questions in philosophy to which I don't think there has every really been a good answer. Or at least I haven't read one.

I use what I like to call "environmental discipline". (I think there is a technical term for this in psychology, but I can't find it off hand. Any psychologists know?) Suppose I need to study, but I don't really feel like it. I can will myself to go to a library or coffee shop with just the books I need to study and no distractions. Once I'm there, there is little choice but to work. However, had I stayed home, where there are myriad distractions, I might have gotten little or nothing done. Packing up and walking to another location is easy compared to sitting down tody study, but once I'm at the new location, sitting down and studying is now surprisingly easy.

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#27

Post by CMCDragonkai »

sah88 wrote: post #10
Xcelerate wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is an interesting point, and brings up a kind of weird philosophical issue I've often wondered about. Suppose that genetically, someone is predisposed to have very high motivation and discipline. Born into whatever environment, they have the aptitude to improving their life. Now imagine someone who, genetically, is predisposed to very low motivation and discipline. Born into a poor, or low-class environment, the…

"Man can do what he wills but he cannot will what he wills." One of the oldest questions in philosophy to which I don't think there has every really been a good answer. Or at least I haven't read one.

But you can change what you will. Are you saying you never change your opinion? Or you never change your wants or dreams?

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#28

Post by legacyfruit »

icegreentea wrote: post #14
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #8

I didn't see where they separate 'nature vs nurture' in their twins study. Was that done? Is it hasty to label these correlations as 'genetic'?

They compare the degree of correlation between their identical and non-identical twins. If in both groups, twins show on average the same level of procrastination/whatever trait, you can infer that the trait is not strongly genetically linked. If the identical twin group shows more correlation between siblings than the non-identical twin group, then you can infer that the trait is strongly genetically linked. You can…

Just thinking out loud here, but if identical twins were much closer in, for example, appearance, couldn't this induce more similarity in other traits. That is, if being identical made twins have closer relationships, might that not result in higher correlations in certain traits, which weren't due to genetics.

Do people tend to know if they are identical or non-identical twins?

Re: Genetic Relations Among Procrastination, Impulsivity, and Goal-Management Ability

#30

Post by ohquu »

cottonseed wrote: post #25
mindvirus wrote: post #7

A little bit off topic: Setting goals is something that I'm pretty bad at - at work, I set obvious goals like "finish project X by Y.", but other than that, I have a hard time setting goals in my life. I have some higher level goals - eat healthy, exercise, read a technical book every quarter, but barely anything approaching SMART goals. Because of this, I feel like I lack ambition sometimes. How do you identify goal…

Make a timeline for the next 10 years. Where are you trying to go? What are you doing to get there? Try to be specific about your plans and actions and how they will realize your goals. This is not an easy exercise. Making a timeline of your past can be helpful for getting perspective. I'm relatively planful, but I have trouble planning more than about 3-5 years out, although a few times I've had pretty clear 8 year…

That sounds terrifying. Can you give some examples of ten year goals? I don't even know where I want to be a year from now.
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