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Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

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Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#21

Post by loceng »

danmaz74 wrote: post #3

It looks to me like it was all organized from the start: If using the economic pressure of gas prices wasn't enough to keep Ukraine in the Russian sphere of influence, they were ready to seize Crimea and maybe something more...

It's quite an ancient "war" technique to simply have population over decades or centuries slowly migrate to a region, and then either through voting power or simply creating a new group of who have a common interest or similar values are now in this new region and can leverage their numbers.

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#22

Post by aaron-lebo »

yardie wrote: post #16

It's a crazy situation all around. Russia has a military base in the Ukraine, in Crimea. If Cuba had a modern day revolution would the US not send in troops to Guantanamo? Would we be in the wrong for doing so? Even if the interim government was more US friendly?

I tend to agree that the US would take such steps, but if the US decided to control larger portions of the country than just their bases (which is what is sounds like Russia is doing), that is a major problem and more than just protecting a military asset.

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#23

Post by 9248 »

xixixao wrote: post #6

I am glad this has finally got to the top of HN. People should be aware of the fact that a part of sovereign country is being aggressively annexed by their neighbor. And there is virtually no opposition to Putin in Russia.

I'm glad this is getting more attention since the vast majority of the developed world doesn't share a lot of knowledge regarding Easter Europe / post Soviet countries.

What's happening currently in Ukraine can easily happen in any other country that's under Russian's sphere of influence, and the only solution, imo, would be the intervention of a 3rd party.

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#24

Post by ck2 »

The scariest part of all of this is the 6000 mystery troops that showed up without any logos on their uniforms or carriers or tanks.

They took over the border, airport, etc. without any identification, simply guns to insist "do as we say". They even blocked the coast guard from leaving their ports.

Which means they had this kind of force all prepared.

Can you imagine if US troops showed up somewhere in huge numbers with all identification hidden (I realize small "special forces" operate that way but not regular troops).

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#25

Post by scarmig »

toyg wrote: post #5
danmaz74 wrote: post #3

It looks to me like it was all organized from the start: If using the economic pressure of gas prices wasn't enough to keep Ukraine in the Russian sphere of influence, they were ready to seize Crimea and maybe something more...

Russia just cannot lose Crimea. It was silly for EU and especially US pols to think Ukraine could be snatched from Putin wholesale (and using neonazis, no less).

neonazis

I guess that's the talking point of the day.

Ironically, Hitler invaded Czechoslovakia under the pretense that it was to protect its ethnic Germans.

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#26

Post by noir_lord »

bananas wrote: post #20
adamlj wrote: post #8

This could turn ugly really fast. If Russia attacks Ukraine the US and Britain would have to protect the borders of Ukraine, according to a treaty signed in 1994 [0]. If the US don't follow the treaty I guess we will know how much these treatys really are worth. [0] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2570335/Former-Briti...

Is there another source other than the daily mail i.e. one with an ounce of credibility?

Good on you for not trusting the Daily Mail, it's not even a rag at this point.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum_on_Security...

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#27

Post by glogla »

It's all going to be fine. Hitler stopped after getting Sudetenland too, right? Oh wait ...

All of Easter Europe should watch this carefully. We all knew that Russia considers all east of Dresden to be their property. When they were leaving here after their invasion of 1968, they told us it's temporary.

Now they are starting to reclaim it. All of it.

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#28

Post by htns »

toyg wrote: post #5
danmaz74 wrote: post #3

It looks to me like it was all organized from the start: If using the economic pressure of gas prices wasn't enough to keep Ukraine in the Russian sphere of influence, they were ready to seize Crimea and maybe something more...

Russia just cannot lose Crimea. It was silly for EU and especially US pols to think Ukraine could be snatched from Putin wholesale (and using neonazis, no less).

I thought the opposite: it makes for a lot influence on Ukraine only if it remains a part of Ukraine. Yesterday I thought Putin would back off after having made a point of "protecting Russians abroad".

Re: Russia approves use of military in Ukraine

#30

Post by gk1 »

danmaz74 wrote: post #18
osipov wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"a part of sovereign country is being aggressively annexed by their neighbor"...sounds like you are getting your media fix from Fox News

Did Ukraine attack Russia in any way? No. Is Ukraine a sovereign Country? Yes. Is Russia sending troops to Ukraine? Yes. This is an invasion. Isn't an invasion an aggression? If not, what is?

You're oversimplifying the situation. Yes, Ukraine is a sovereign country. But half of it is ethnically Russian, and identify themselves a such. The Ukrainian border--like many geopolitical borders--is arbitrary and does not signify a single united nation.

I'm not saying one side is right and the other is wrong. I'm just highlighting the fact that's it's not as simple as you make it out to be.

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