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The Bay Area

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Re: The Bay Area

#21

Post by 100k »

DiabloD3 wrote: post #10

I have to admit, this guy has balls for saying these things. I am not saying I agree with him OR disagree with him, but online reputation affects your ability to get hired by tech companies. I have not read the whole saga of this, but this may positively or negatively his chances of getting another job in the tech sector. Also, the comments are worth looking through, ageism has also been brought up (and, as an outsid…

Mr. Bray is likely quite wealthy and unlikely has to worry so much about getting a job, both due to being a well-known technologist and having "fuck you" money (in his previous post about leaving Google he writes, "From a financial point of view I could just stop working, but that would be boring and unhealthy").

Re: The Bay Area

#22

Post by rootedbox »

I'm hispanic living in the mission, and for a long time I also had 2 black roommates. We've had many conversations about direct blatant racism, and also indirect just people being ignorant in what they say bigotry. Of course a lot of non-minorities have issues understanding the difference in racism, and bigotry.

This being said. What is brought up in this article is racism. Specifically the institution of racism. If you are not actively doing things to fix the institutions of racism, and sexism; then you are actively part of an institution of racism and sexism. Silicon Valley / San Francisco has done very little to fix racism, and sexism. If we all got together and wanted to defeat these institutions we could do so in 20 years; and work at places where the race, and sex of workers is representative of the general public.

Re: The Bay Area

#23

Post by jedmeyers »

savvyraccoon wrote: post #8

The same "racism" in Vancouver: "Most of Metro Vancouver’s Filipinos value being near transit hubs – since many need to travel inexpensively to low-tomiddle-wage jobs as nannies, cleaners, seniors care aids, security officials, service clerks, short-order cooks and practical nurses" http://blogs.vancouversun.com/2011/10/17/ethnic-mapping-3-fi...

How dare you claim that Capital of the Anti-racism, warm and fuzzy Vancouver is racist!

Racism in Vancouver: We Need to Stop Pretending It Doesn't Exist (http://groupthink.jezebel.com/racism-in-vancouver-we-need-to...)

"No, no, no — it's okay. Because every Canadian will tell you it's NBD because they're not as bad as Americans. "

Re: The Bay Area

#24

Post by Patrick_Devine »

savvyraccoon wrote: post #8

The same "racism" in Vancouver: "Most of Metro Vancouver’s Filipinos value being near transit hubs – since many need to travel inexpensively to low-tomiddle-wage jobs as nannies, cleaners, seniors care aids, security officials, service clerks, short-order cooks and practical nurses" http://blogs.vancouversun.com/2011/10/17/ethnic-mapping-3-fi...

To be fair, people of all income levels and races use the Skytrain in Vancouver, and the most dense parts of the city are all clustered around it.

Re: The Bay Area

#25

Post by justinzollars »

angryindianguy wrote: post #16

>I can’t help noticing that 100% of the people I see who are building the future and making the big bucks are ethnically Chinese, Indian, or white. And 100% of the people I see who are washing floors or guarding doors or serving fast food are black and Mexican and Central-American. I am sorry I used to think that Tim Bray was a smart guy. Hell Indians in India are far more poorer than African Americans. Now if some i…

He's probably still pretty smart with computer stuff, he's just not capable of talking about other topics. If I were him I'd generally try not to insult whole groups of people and entire cities.

Re: The Bay Area

#26

Post by sliverstorm »

jmagoon wrote: post #9
nemothekid wrote: post #6

>I can’t help noticing that 100% of the people I see who are building the future and making the big bucks are ethnically Chinese, Indian, or white. And 100% of the people I see who are washing floors or guarding doors or serving fast food are black and Mexican and Central-American. Painting this social issue as racism is incorrect and using racism as a boogeyman, sweeps the real issues under the rug. I'm confident th…

I've always heard of this referred to as institutional racism: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_racism "When racism is built into the institution, it appears as the collective action of the population", thus "San Francisco is racist".

Your parent is arguing that the lines drawn along race are merely correlated, rather than the cause. Thus, not institutional racism.

In other words, the system is failing people not because of their colour, culture, or ethnic origin, but because of their class, which happens to roughly line up with race.

The difference between "You are poor because you are Mexican/from Mexico" and "You are poor because you started out poor, and it just so happens that you are from Mexico where a lot of people started out poor".

Re: The Bay Area

#27

Post by jedmeyers »

rootedbox wrote: post #22

I'm hispanic living in the mission, and for a long time I also had 2 black roommates. We've had many conversations about direct blatant racism, and also indirect just people being ignorant in what they say bigotry. Of course a lot of non-minorities have issues understanding the difference in racism, and bigotry. This being said. What is brought up in this article is racism. Specifically the institution of racism. If…

What actions do you propose Silicon Valley should take to fix the issues of racism?

Re: The Bay Area

#28

Post by jisaacstone »

nemothekid wrote: post #6

>I can’t help noticing that 100% of the people I see who are building the future and making the big bucks are ethnically Chinese, Indian, or white. And 100% of the people I see who are washing floors or guarding doors or serving fast food are black and Mexican and Central-American. Painting this social issue as racism is incorrect and using racism as a boogeyman, sweeps the real issues under the rug. I'm confident th…

I think you are mostly correct. More precisely, if you take away race you will see that the distinction is 90% education-based. Specifically talking about immigrants, those indians and chinese (and japanese, pakistani, nepalese, korean, iranian, etc) as well as the eastern eropeans that you do not see all have a good education an most likely come from at least the top half of their society.

The Hispanic immigrants are more likely from a lower class an much more likely to have arrived on something like a family visa with no higher education at all.

Re: The Bay Area

#29

Post by countrybama24 »

There is a selection bias here. Immigrating from Asia is significantly more difficult and expensive than Central America. I would hypothesize that immigrants from these areas are more ambitious, economically better off and more capable on average than immigrants from nearby countries (and maybe even "native" Americans). Additionally, immigrants are more likely to assimilate into local American life and have better relationships with American institutions (police, schools, etc.) than African-Americans who unlike immigrants, didn't choose to be here and are more likely to view such institutions in a negative light.

Re: The Bay Area

#30

Post by fredgrott »

justinzollars wrote: post #25
angryindianguy wrote: post #16

>I can’t help noticing that 100% of the people I see who are building the future and making the big bucks are ethnically Chinese, Indian, or white. And 100% of the people I see who are washing floors or guarding doors or serving fast food are black and Mexican and Central-American. I am sorry I used to think that Tim Bray was a smart guy. Hell Indians in India are far more poorer than African Americans. Now if some i…

He's probably still pretty smart with computer stuff, he's just not capable of talking about other topics. If I were him I'd generally try not to insult whole groups of people and entire cities.

No, this is incorrect..

You solve ignorance by involving ignorant in conversations..

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