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Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

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Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#21

Post by tux10 »

pjmlp wrote: post #12
tux10 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I am talking about individuals. I guess I am not their target customer though. Obviously to big companies a few thousand is nothing (especially when you look at >$10k for MSDN Ultimate) but Embarcadero have zero products aimed towards the individual developer (not even the Starter Edition is worth it as it is so limited for the price).

> Embarcadero have zero products aimed towards the individual developer I think that is a sign of what the company has become, after being about to close so many times. I bet it lives mostly from enterprise legacy contracts nowadays.

Yeah I can't remember the last place I saw running any Borland/Embarcadero software with the exception of some really old stuff still compiled with C++Builder6. That place was also running Visual Studio 6 for some stuff too :) Ahh the memories.

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#22

Post by [deleted] »

pjmlp wrote: post #19
lobster_johnson wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They really, really wanted to become an "enterprise" company. They acquired certain management people who saw development tools as a dead end, and decided all the money was in the enterprise. But they misjudged the market, and invested in products like Visibroker and Midas (and dead-end tech like CORBA), not really understanding what they ought to be building. (This wasn't the beginning of their troubles, though. The…

Thanks for sharing your experience, very interesting. I left the ecosystem around Delphi 1.0, when I started to be more focused on UNIX at the university and only had p2c available. :( For me C++ has the way out as it provided many of the language capabilities that Object Pascal also had. Like many C++ early adopters, I also created my own set of classes (vector, string, lists) that insulated me from the unsafe C wor…

[deleted]

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#23

Post by lobster_johnson »

pjmlp wrote: post #19
lobster_johnson wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They really, really wanted to become an "enterprise" company. They acquired certain management people who saw development tools as a dead end, and decided all the money was in the enterprise. But they misjudged the market, and invested in products like Visibroker and Midas (and dead-end tech like CORBA), not really understanding what they ought to be building. (This wasn't the beginning of their troubles, though. The…

Thanks for sharing your experience, very interesting. I left the ecosystem around Delphi 1.0, when I started to be more focused on UNIX at the university and only had p2c available. :( For me C++ has the way out as it provided many of the language capabilities that Object Pascal also had. Like many C++ early adopters, I also created my own set of classes (vector, string, lists) that insulated me from the unsafe C wor…

It's a curious thing, technology exposure and ending up using — and being limited by — what you know exists.

I remember getting an Amiga in the early 1990s. I had programmed in assembly language on the C64, so on the Amiga I learned the Motorola 68000 assembly language, of course. I didn't know any other type of programming (other than BASIC). I had heard about C, but I didn't know people used it to write software on the Amiga. I remember buying a book about Intuition (the AmigaOS windowing system) and trying to figure out how to call the APIs from assembly language, which was of course fruitless, as I didn't even know how about the concept of linking, let alone how to look up library functions from assembly. Nobody had told me about C!

So I was a Windows person in the 1990s because that was the thing people used at home, and it was natural for me to use Delphi, not C++. I had looked at C++, but the possibility of using C++ for my projects never really struck me. Delphi was such a phenomenally productive tool. Windows seemed like the only viable platform. A lot of people are exposed to UNIX in university, but I didn't go there, so my first taste of UNIX was (aside from Amiga) Linux.

I agree with you about C++. I've had fun writing Go, but it feels like a stopgap solution until the real next-level language appears. Rust, maybe. Nimrod does look cool.

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#24

Post by pjmlp »

lobster_johnson wrote: post #20
networked wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What you're saying rings true to me. I also learned Borland/Turbo/Object Pascal first (perhaps somewhat unusually, I went from Borland Pascal to C++ to Delphi when learning to program as a kid). Although I can't say I never liked C there are many things about Object Pascal I found superior that I miss in C, especially the built-in string type (for those who haven't used it, in C-land it can be compared to bstrings bu…

Nimrod does indeed look very much inspired by Object Pascal (it even uses the classic Borland "T" and "P" prefixes for types and pointers, respectively, something I honestly never liked). Object Pascal was a fine language, but I don't see the point of using it today, not without removing a lot of the historical Pascal warts (begin/end, the weird semicolon rules, somewhat poor integration with C, etc.), and then you p…

Actualy C# I would say. ;)

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#25

Post by lobster_johnson »

pjmlp wrote: post #24
lobster_johnson wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nimrod does indeed look very much inspired by Object Pascal (it even uses the classic Borland "T" and "P" prefixes for types and pointers, respectively, something I honestly never liked). Object Pascal was a fine language, but I don't see the point of using it today, not without removing a lot of the historical Pascal warts (begin/end, the weird semicolon rules, somewhat poor integration with C, etc.), and then you p…

Actualy C# I would say. ;)

Indeed! C# seems like the bastard child of Java and Delphi.

To be honest, I don't think I could ever go back to a language where method names started with an upper case letter. What were we thinking!

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#26

Post by mamcx »

tux10 wrote: post #21
pjmlp wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Embarcadero have zero products aimed towards the individual developer I think that is a sign of what the company has become, after being about to close so many times. I bet it lives mostly from enterprise legacy contracts nowadays.

Yeah I can't remember the last place I saw running any Borland/Embarcadero software with the exception of some really old stuff still compiled with C++Builder6. That place was also running Visual Studio 6 for some stuff too :) Ahh the memories.

Delphi 3 was the first program that I pay for (second was visual foxpro). Obviously, at US99 a student like me could do it. I'm moderator in the http://www.clubdelphi.com and is sad to see all the same faces all the time. New blood is hard to get, specially in latin america, when .NET is affordable/free and all the open source stuff.

Is sad that the misguided strategy that start with the Borland has pass up to Embarcadero. Where they must look for broad appeal they decide to milk instead :(. Delphi was huge (Delphi 3 - 5) and if they have more critical mass now will be a powerful force. The worst? Delphi is SOOOO good that have survived despite all the problems so far.

Still, Delphi + Python are my favorites languages of all the time...

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#27

Post by cmollis »

here's what most cross-platform library vendors never get: it's actually easier, and ultimately faster, to learn each environment's native API, then learn one cross-platform API and all of the idiosyncrasies on each platform it supports. Inevitably, there will be some aspect of the native platform that doesn't work correctly within the x-platform sdk and then you have to hack around it.

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#28

Post by barrkel »

malkia wrote: post #8
japaget wrote: post #2

Embarcadero C++Builder is the successor to Borland's Turbo C. It has changed names several times, having been marketed under the brands Borland, Inprise, CodeGear, and Embarcadero.

Makes me wonder if they should not bring the old Borland name (or even Turbo). That'll resonate at least with a lot more older developers (that might be managers now). I stared with programming with TURBO.COM (Turbo Pascal 3.0) - it was 33kb DOS executable and had built-in editor - fit on a diskette, and there was space for other things. I skipped version 4 (Turbo/Borland Pascal) and had most fun with 5.0 and 5.5, th…

The Borland name was bought by Microfocus after Borland sold the developer tools division to Embarcadero.

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#29

Post by onezeno »

tux10 wrote: post #21
pjmlp wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Embarcadero have zero products aimed towards the individual developer I think that is a sign of what the company has become, after being about to close so many times. I bet it lives mostly from enterprise legacy contracts nowadays.

Yeah I can't remember the last place I saw running any Borland/Embarcadero software with the exception of some really old stuff still compiled with C++Builder6. That place was also running Visual Studio 6 for some stuff too :) Ahh the memories.

I work in C++Builder 6 still (small company). I'm trying to get things ported to Qt.

Re: Embarcadero Bridges Gap From Desktop to Mobile - supports iOS in C++Builder XE5

#30

Post by pjmlp »

lobster_johnson wrote: post #23
pjmlp wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for sharing your experience, very interesting. I left the ecosystem around Delphi 1.0, when I started to be more focused on UNIX at the university and only had p2c available. :( For me C++ has the way out as it provided many of the language capabilities that Object Pascal also had. Like many C++ early adopters, I also created my own set of classes (vector, string, lists) that insulated me from the unsafe C wor…

It's a curious thing, technology exposure and ending up using — and being limited by — what you know exists. I remember getting an Amiga in the early 1990s. I had programmed in assembly language on the C64, so on the Amiga I learned the Motorola 68000 assembly language, of course. I didn't know any other type of programming (other than BASIC). I had heard about C, but I didn't know people used it to write software on…

Yeah, on those days we only got to know what our friends new.

No Internet, No BBS, No Network.

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