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Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

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Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#21
Even though I had my personal interest to learn English, back when internet was not common, or not very accessible due to dialup, i would buy English newspapers and study them, and always keep a dictionary with them.

However, that was bit silly and a lot more time consuming.

The best to improve English is to be part of a community (an online forum). it's up to you which you want to join. Only join the one which interests you. Get involved in lengthy debates and discussiona, I know it's not cool, but just for the sake of learning and improving your English.

If you follow up above advice, your English skills will skyrocket in a very short time compared to traditional methods.

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#22
As a qualified, practising teacher of English as a foreign language, I guess I should be able to help.

For competence, once you've got past the basics of grammar, it's mostly about memory. Create a database of words, phrases, and example sentences, and use some kind of Spaced Repetition System (e.g. Anki) to keep reviewing them.

Fluency is harder. First, what does it mean to be fluent?

Last time you were in a shop and the shopkeeper handed you your change, what did you say?

Thank you.

Did you plan ahead? Did you think, "Oh heck. The shop keeper's just given me some change. What should I say now?" Of course not. The words just came to your lips. You were following a script that you'd internalised at a subconscious level. That's fluency.

So you need to internalise more scripts. How are you going to do that? Learn them. Seriously ... that's all there is to it. Just memorise huge chunks of text. Songs, movies, passages from your English textbook, and so on.

In particular, try shadowing. (I.e. speaking in synchrony with the audio version.) At first, do it with the printed version in front of you. Then do it purely from memory. Try exaggerating the accent when you do it, too. It may sound ridiculous, but to native speakers it will sound better than your normal Italian accent.

You'll see the benefits of all this hard work when you're in conversation. Fragments of memorised dialogue will pop into your head exactly when you need them, just like when you said Thank you. to the cashier.

By the way, children do this instinctively. That's why they love to watch the same movie, or hear the same story, over and over again.

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#23
post #22

As a qualified, practising teacher of English as a foreign language, I guess I should be able to help. For competence, once you've got past the basics of grammar, it's mostly about memory. Create a database of words, phrases, and example sentences, and use some kind of Spaced Repetition System (e.g. Anki ) to keep reviewing them. Fluency is harder. First, what does it mean to be fluent? Last time you were in a shop a…

It's nice to hear this from a professional. I am an English speaker who speaks a couple foreign languages. When I am alone in my car, I talk to myself in foreign languages or have mock conversations. I repeat them over and over again. Then in a real conversation, I mix and match large phrases from my vault of mock conversations rather than translate word for word.

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#24
There's a story of a Korean boy who learned English after coming to the United States by watching Simpsons episodes with the subtitles on. He'd write down every word / sentence that he didn't understand, find it's meaning and learn it. Then when the same episode was aired again later in the week, he'd watch it again to make sure that he understood.

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#26
Only practice can take her English at the desired level somewhat quickly. I'm trilingual with a forth language under my belt and in my opinion she has to spend as much time as possible with native English speakers (or with people who speak English very well). Unfortunately you aren't a native speaker so more than likely she's exposed to Italian more than English. This is a major hurdle. Reading is good. Listening is great but nothing beats discussing. One-on-one conversation classes could be great. You could look for people willing to practice Italian in exchange for English practice. Check "meetup"s in your region so that you can meet people and discuss in English (in whatever topic that is of interest to you). There's no doubt that she has to study grammar and vocabulary. She has to read a lot (It is important to use tools/apps/dictionaries that can speak the searched words). But I would concentrate heavily on English communication.

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#27

This is one situation where watching TV as a background activity might actually be helpful. The best way to learn English is to surround yourself with English as much as possible. So, read, watch TV, talk to people, and to speak English at home as much as possible. On the other hand, I bet her English is actually better than she thinks it is. I've met a lot of non-native English speakers who have unnecessarily apolog…

As a former ESL teacher, I think TV can be helpful but it's better to be very selective about which shows you watch. Pick shows that have a lot of dialogue in English.

Older TV shows tend to be more dialogue-centric. If you have the TV Land channel, I'd suggest: MASH, All in the Family, I Love Lucy, The Honeymooners, The Dick Van Dyke Show, &c.

Contemporary shows that would be good for this purpose might be: Modern Family, NCIS, Mad Men, Big Bang Theory, Parks and Recreation, Arrested Development, Parenthood (advanced: lots of simultaneous talking).

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#28
I've been in this situation in another language: nothing beats (1) reading and (2) listening and (3) forcing yourself to speak.

It sounds like (3) may be a problem for your wife because of her lack of confidence. Forcing herself to speak English, as if there is no option, will make the difference.

If you two were to speak English to each other, so that she could literally stay in English-only mode all day, every day, that would help. Don't call mom. Does she read a newspaper? Read the Chronicle or NY Times or Guardian. Listen to the radio? Listen to NPR, or BBC. Etc.

BTW, do not set as a goal to speak American-accented perfectly idiomatic English. That will never happen, and is not necessary or even desirable. Italian accents rock.

Re: Ask HN: What's the best way for a foreigner to improve English to a great level?

#29
I'll give you my honest suggestion? Do not waste 4 months learning the language. Just let her go to work. At work, she will interact with all kinds of people which effectively exposes her to the language. That way she will learn the language more quickly and naturally rather than coaching or lessons or whatever.

I live in Saudi Arabia and as a non Arab I had a very difficult time speaking Arabic. I too spent a lot of time trying to learn the language before hand but it's nowhere effective to what you learn in a real situation with people.

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