Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

designinstruct.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 104 posts

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#21

Post by dntrkv »

splatzone wrote: post #11
dntrkv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it was around Outlook 2007 Microsoft decided that instead of using Internet Explorer to render their emails, they would use Microsoft Word. That's right. Word. And now whenever you try to use even the most basic CSS rules, Outlook fucks it up very badly. Then there is that abomination called Lotus Notes (mainly Outlook 2007 makes IE6 look like the best browser in the world.

Thank you for the explanation, that's insane.

It is very insane. You would think that after getting such a bad rep with IE that they would make sure they don't get themselves into that kind of situation again, but no. They keep releasing shitty software that holds the rest of the industry back. I never was a Microsoft hater, but in the past few weeks of writing HTML/CSS (if you can call it that) for Outlook support, I have cursed Outlook more than any other piece of software I can remember.

You can read more about it here: http://www.email-standards.org/blog/entry/microsoft-to-ignor...

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#23

Post by niteshade »

andybak wrote: post #17
splatzone wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for the explanation, that's insane.

If I recall correctly - they did it for security reasons. i.e. Internet Explorer was so full of holes they thought the Word HTML rendered would be easier to keep secure. In the sense that it did a lot less and thus presented a smaller attack surface, they were right.

Guess its a pity Microsoft never heard about sandboxing, eh?

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#25

Post by cookingrobot »

splatzone wrote: post #11
dntrkv wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it was around Outlook 2007 Microsoft decided that instead of using Internet Explorer to render their emails, they would use Microsoft Word. That's right. Word. And now whenever you try to use even the most basic CSS rules, Outlook fucks it up very badly. Then there is that abomination called Lotus Notes (mainly Outlook 2007 makes IE6 look like the best browser in the world.

Thank you for the explanation, that's insane.

I believe the motivation was that most Outlook users were at corporations who sent/received most of their emails from coworkers who also used Outlook.

What these users really wanted was the ability to edit and format their emails the same way they did in Word. Word really is a fantastic document editor/formatter, and I don't know of any html doc editor that comes close to the flexibility, ease, and power of Word.

So they traded standards for what people really wanted - email that they could format.

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#26

Post by eli »

buckbova wrote: post #13
crisnoble wrote: post #2

Anyone brave enough to bring a semblance of sanity to the world of HTML emails deserves major kudos. For kids like me who did not grow up making table layouts, coding emails is a nightmare. Oh the 's. I am so glad Zurb is lending their knowledge building of excellent frameworks to this widely underserved market.

I never needed to get into table hell. I used an image map every time. One image. Define some areas with different links. Bingo. https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Element/ma...

So what do the majority of recipients see (who don't have images load by default)?

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#27

Post by azio_m »

crisnoble wrote: post #2

Anyone brave enough to bring a semblance of sanity to the world of HTML emails deserves major kudos. For kids like me who did not grow up making table layouts, coding emails is a nightmare. Oh the 's. I am so glad Zurb is lending their knowledge building of excellent frameworks to this widely underserved market.

Huh. While I rarely use them nowadays, I still find tables much easier than divs.

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#28

Post by elwell »

eli wrote: post #26
buckbova wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never needed to get into table hell. I used an image map every time. One image. Define some areas with different links. Bingo. https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/HTML/Element/ma...

So what do the majority of recipients see (who don't have images load by default)?

Um, I'm pretty sure he was joking.

Re: Zurb Ink: Responsive HTML Email Framework

#29

Post by ye »

splatzone wrote: post #6

Lovely framework, but can someone explain why HTML email is so stuck in the past? Why can't email clients just abide by proper web standards?

Because security and privacy.

There's a very good reason why your email client doesn't display images by default.

Imagine every major email client allowed using HTML5/CSS3.

One day somebody discovers a bug that allows you to execute random code. Now all you need to deliver a trojan to millions of people is mass-email it.

Post reply on HN