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Cypherpunks 2.0

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Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#21

Post by TheLegace »

rektide wrote: post #18
hershel wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we're talking about privacy, even fully securing a single device per person would be highly usefull and should not be dependent on what is the status of other devices.

Actually, no: we're not talking about privacy here. I was asserting how incredibly boring privacy is today, and how we should stop talking about it because it's boring (except to me and you and our small cadre of crypherpunk friends) and we're locked out of understanding it in practice: If you don't own the software (no one does), don't have control over it's behavior (no one does) and cannot see it's data (no one ca…

Thanks, but as much I'd like to agree with opening things up, I don't think we have to give up our privacy or security for it.

By that exact same definition of software being interoperable and "aware" doesn't mean we have to expose our privacy. This may not be a popular option, but free(or paid) web services should allow us to store our own data, our own emails but make available interfaces and convenience of accessing our own stored data elsewhere.

The vast majority of people obviously do not care or even understand, they can happily choose to host on the cloud. I'm not letting my mom decide what Internet security and privacy laws should be. She cannot even comprehend what the implications of Facebook are.

I'd also like to mention not everyone lives in the hunky dory developed world where we're free to have opinions(debatable) and violent oppression is frowned upon.

The vast majority of the world does not live that way and has a lot of hardships to go through. Exposing their ability of free expression could hinder their ability to better their lives and maybe one day us.

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#23

Post by dead_phish »

I was mostly on board with this, until I saw Crypto-Cat front and center on their 'new projects' page. If anything, it's a step backwards for cryptography. Saying that you're secure and can be trusted, when the underlying model is broken is not a good way to promote 'modern cypherpunk'-ism.

I think there's a heavy dose of self-absorption going on here.

Link to the most recent breakdown on Cryptocat I could find. https://datavibe.net/~sneak/20130717/cryptocat-considered-ha...

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#24

Post by unhush »

I went to this talk last night and wrote a blog post in response to it: http://zyan.scripts.mit.edu/blog/thoughts-on-cypherpunks-2-0...

The gist of it is that although the Cypherpunks 2.0 movement is doing fantastic pro-privacy work, it will eventually be constrained by the apathy of the average person who uses technology (aka, surveillance victim). I don't know how we can fight this, but we should try.

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#25

Post by tambourine_man »

Yet another unreadable site in the iPhone. If you are doing something fancy, you should test it extensively. Otherwise, stick to the basics. At least people will have a chance of accessing to your content.

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#26

Post by makomk »

dead_phish wrote: post #23

I was mostly on board with this, until I saw Crypto-Cat front and center on their 'new projects' page. If anything, it's a step backwards for cryptography. Saying that you're secure and can be trusted, when the underlying model is broken is not a good way to promote 'modern cypherpunk'-ism. I think there's a heavy dose of self-absorption going on here. Link to the most recent breakdown on Cryptocat I could find. http…

Cryptocat is a little better than it used to be, thanks to the developers dropping most of their homebrew crypto and implementing a version of the OTR protocol. Apparently they've even finally implemented authentication using SMP challenges, which was a major usability issue compared to traditional OTR clients. Until very recently, the only way to be sure someone wasn't running a man in the middle attack was to manually compare key hashes over an authenticated channel (and you had to do this every session at one point). The OTR developers had already discovered years earlier that this was enough of a pain that most people didn't bother and developed a more user-friendly alternative, but sadly it involved some fairly exotic crypto that the Cryptocat developers took an age to implement.

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#27

Post by tbirdz »

I thought the content of the presentation was good, but the format was kind of confusing. There wasn't any indication of where to click to advance the slideshow, or any indication that you were supposed to press space or right arrow to go on. In fact, I didn't even realize it was a slideshow until I came onto the Hacker News comments and saw what people had posted. After clicking around a bit, I had just assumed that the page was broken due to heavy load, or maybe there was an issue in my browser.

I think clicking on the black border isn't something that is obvious at all. Perhaps you could have some arrow icons on the side to navigate? Or even a text tooltip indicating that this is in fact a slideshow, and you can click on the borders or use keyboard shortcuts to continue.

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#28

Post by na85 »

A featureless website with no info or anything?

edit: oh, I see from the comments that it's a presentation and you have to click on the black border where there's no indication that you should click.

Allow me to use this opportunity to mention how awful this is from a UI/UX perspective. Terrible design.

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#29

Post by prezjordan »

na85 wrote: post #28

A featureless website with no info or anything? edit: oh, I see from the comments that it's a presentation and you have to click on the black border where there's no indication that you should click. Allow me to use this opportunity to mention how awful this is from a UI/UX perspective. Terrible design.

I immediately went for the arrow keys. That being said, I noticed that most people really aren't sure what to do when they see an intro slide [0]. A couple of arrows in the bottom corner never hurt anybody.

[0]: http://jdan.github.io/cleaver/

Re: Cypherpunks 2.0

#30

Post by hormesis »

I thought it was an interesting presentation, but like many others here, I wouldn't have known it was anything had people not mentioned to press the space bar.
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