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The Self-Employed Depression

nytimes.com

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Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#21

Post by bjplink »

st3fan wrote: post #10

So anyone here having financial problems as a software dev freelancer? Do you feel the recession?

I've been a freelance web developer, off and on, since I graduated from college in 2003. My latest "freelance stint" has just recently passed the one year mark. In between I've had full-time jobs for people who eventually became steady freelance clients. So that's my background.

Until recently, I had seen a huge drop off in requests for proposals and the few I did get were dead ends. In hindsight, this started happening during the early winter of last year. But in the last few months I've been picking up more odd jobs so on that front, at least in the short-term, things seems to be getting better.

I haven't had to go out and actively seek new clients in quite awhile because I've put together a steady stable of recurring clients. Most of my client base is in the professional sports field and even in down economic times, teams still need to keep their websites up and running. So that's my "secret" to freelance success in a bad economy: have good clients in stable industries.

Aside from freelance web dev work, I've also put together a decent network of sites earning money through advertising. At this time last year those sites were on pace to make a respectable amount of money each year. It wasn't a living wage but some months it came awfully damn close. Since the economy went to the dump I've seen a huge drop off in revenue from these sites. Some earn 50% less now than they did at this time last year. This income was, for lack of a better term, unnecessary for me to pay my bills and live so while it's a bummer I can live without it.

This was a bit rambling but that's my experience so far with the poor economy as a freelance web developer.

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#22

Post by villageidiot »

bjplink wrote: post #21
st3fan wrote: post #10

So anyone here having financial problems as a software dev freelancer? Do you feel the recession?

I've been a freelance web developer, off and on, since I graduated from college in 2003. My latest "freelance stint" has just recently passed the one year mark. In between I've had full-time jobs for people who eventually became steady freelance clients. So that's my background. Until recently, I had seen a huge drop off in requests for proposals and the few I did get were dead ends. In hindsight, this started happen…

->"I've also put together a decent network of sites earning money through advertising".

Care to let us in on any of your secrets?

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#23

Post by dualogy »

mynameishere wrote: post #16
patio11 wrote: post #2

At the Freelancers Union, Sara Horowitz is pushing for a new kind of unemployment protection fund that would cover the self-employed by helping them put away money that they could draw on in times of need. We could call it "savings". Then, in lean times, workers could tap their "savings" to make up for temporary shortfalls in income. To minimize the cost of administration for this innovative unemployment protection f…

Well, you're missing the point of insurance. A hundred people might need to collectively save a million dollars, but acting independently they would need 10 million. With the self-employed the tragedy of the commons would kick in mighty fast though.

We could call it "credit", which the "banks" would offer out of their collective pool of customer "savings", not all of which need to be available to all "savers" at once.

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#24

Post by yummyfajitas »

olefoo wrote: post #19

I read the comments here and I was prepared for some tale of woe involving gross financial mismanagement and staggering levels of yuppie self-regard. Then I read the article; now I'm disgusted, with the attitudes on display here. I hate to break it to you guys but what's happening to her could happen to you. To put it in terms of a startup she got into a booming market and was moderately successful, when the economy…

Let me put it in terms of a startup. She got into a market for the lifestyle (with relatively low pay) and now the customers went away. The solution? Look for a regular job and build up savings for your next venture (or to keep the regular job).

Her initial reaction:

"If you had a regular job and you didn’t have all that travel time, would you make better money in the end?" She gave a small laugh. "But I love what I do. So I try not to think about that."

Fast forward:

She has been auditioning to teach at new studios and e-mailing former clients to offer private lessons, and she added four hours a week of office work for Karma Kids Yoga.

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#25

Post by olefoo »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #24
olefoo wrote: post #19

I read the comments here and I was prepared for some tale of woe involving gross financial mismanagement and staggering levels of yuppie self-regard. Then I read the article; now I'm disgusted, with the attitudes on display here. I hate to break it to you guys but what's happening to her could happen to you. To put it in terms of a startup she got into a booming market and was moderately successful, when the economy…

Let me put it in terms of a startup. She got into a market for the lifestyle (with relatively low pay) and now the customers went away. The solution? Look for a regular job and build up savings for your next venture (or to keep the regular job). Her initial reaction: "If you had a regular job and you didn’t have all that travel time, would you make better money in the end?" She gave a small laugh. "But I love what I…

Was there a point you were trying to make?

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#26

Post by asciilifeform »

ahoyhere wrote: post #20
roc wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've wondered the same for -ages-. Why isn't there a law that -requires- any employer who provides insurance to contribute the dollar amount they would put toward an employee's plan to -any- private plan the employee wishes? Currently you need a fairly generous employer to even offer you a cash 'bonus' for waiving company insurance and buying private. And even then, it's very rarely comparable to what the company wou…

Because we don't have a democratic capitalist system, we have a corporatist oligopoly. The federal govt was set up to be toothless -- and consequently lacking in responsibility -- on purpose. Then it overstepped those bounds in terms of power, but never in terms of responsibility. So you have a rate of federal income tax that is double, triple, or more that of your resident state, while getting almost nothing in retu…

If you don't intend to return, why pay the tax?

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#27

Post by chollida1 »

ahoyhere wrote: post #13
patio11 wrote: post #2

At the Freelancers Union, Sara Horowitz is pushing for a new kind of unemployment protection fund that would cover the self-employed by helping them put away money that they could draw on in times of need. We could call it "savings". Then, in lean times, workers could tap their "savings" to make up for temporary shortfalls in income. To minimize the cost of administration for this innovative unemployment protection f…

Since employed people have it, why shouldn't self-employed? Remember, the goal of society is not to punish the grasshopper and feel great and virtuous because you're an ant. The goal is to help every grasshopper become an ant, even if it's not in their nature. Because when grasshoppers starve, ants lose out too. Research shows that, among employed people, contributions to private retirement funds soar if the employer…

> Since employed people have it, why shouldn't self-employed?

Often the problem comes down to fraud. The reason self employed people in Canada can't get EI( our unemployment insurance) is that it's too easy to lay your self off.

For these same reasons, family members can't be layed off from a company.

If we did have this EI for self employed people how would we differentiate between someone who just wants the summer off vs someone who legitimately has no clients.

Another problem is what happens when someone realizes that they can make more money on EI than trying to tough it out with their remaining clients and trying to rebuild their business?

If each case has to be reviewed by an actual person this could take weeks at a time and would probably eat all of the money put into the pot for this new style of EI.

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#28

Post by ahoyhere »

asciilifeform wrote: post #26
ahoyhere wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because we don't have a democratic capitalist system, we have a corporatist oligopoly. The federal govt was set up to be toothless -- and consequently lacking in responsibility -- on purpose. Then it overstepped those bounds in terms of power, but never in terms of responsibility. So you have a rate of federal income tax that is double, triple, or more that of your resident state, while getting almost nothing in retu…

If you don't intend to return, why pay the tax?

I mean I never intend to move back to the US. I like to visit.

And I'd like to not get arrested at the border and forcibly repatriated, if you get my drift.

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#29

Post by yummyfajitas »

olefoo wrote: post #25
yummyfajitas wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me put it in terms of a startup. She got into a market for the lifestyle (with relatively low pay) and now the customers went away. The solution? Look for a regular job and build up savings for your next venture (or to keep the regular job). Her initial reaction: "If you had a regular job and you didn’t have all that travel time, would you make better money in the end?" She gave a small laugh. "But I love what I…

Was there a point you were trying to make?

Yes. Her problem is not simply bad luck. Her problem is that for a while she was unwilling to entertain jobs she didn't like, and even now she only does it for 4 hours/week.

That's what won't happen to most of us. Rather than filling out the form for food assistance, we will be filling out recruiters info sheets describing "a time I worked as part of a team" and rating our C++ skills on a scale of 1-10.

Re: The Self-Employed Depression

#30

Post by cosinepi »

yummyfajitas wrote: post #29
olefoo wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was there a point you were trying to make?

Yes. Her problem is not simply bad luck. Her problem is that for a while she was unwilling to entertain jobs she didn't like, and even now she only does it for 4 hours/week. That's what won't happen to most of us. Rather than filling out the form for food assistance, we will be filling out recruiters info sheets describing "a time I worked as part of a team" and rating our C++ skills on a scale of 1-10.

"That's what won't happen to most of us. Rather than filling out the form for food assistance, we will be filling out recruiters info sheets describing "a time I worked as part of a team" and rating our C++ skills on a scale of 1-10."

Did you mean "Rather than" or "Before"?

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