Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

themiddlewareman.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 58 posts

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#21

Post by yackob03 »

alexlarsson wrote: post #6
StavrosK wrote: post #4

I would very much like to use Docker/containers to provision and deploy my software stacks on a beefy server I have. The ideal for me would be a whole VM in a container (nginx/uwsgi/redis/postgres/etc), but Docker can't currently do that (it only runs a single process). Is there a practical/good way to easily do what I want, with Docker or another tool?

The process docker runs in the container can be /sbin/init, which spawns an entire OS. Its just not how its normally used.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know Docker actually does run a binary called /sbin/init, it's just that they've replaced it in the base images with something that is more suited for fast startup times and running of a single process. Setting the Docker start command to init will probably not accomplish what you want.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#22

Post by tenfourty »

gabrtv wrote: post #20

Contrary to what you might think, those of us working on http://deis.io/ are excited by the Red Hat / Docker partnership and its implications on interoperability. Why? Because there will never be a one-size-fits-all PaaS. Deis happens to be built around Chef with a workflow deeply inspired by Heroku. We believe strongly in that approach. Other PaaS's are working with more experimental technologies like CoreOS and etc…

I absolutely agree with you, Docker is where the community seems to be converging for standardisation around linux containers. This is a great first step towards application portability from physical, virtual and PaaS. Now it will be interesting to see who/what will win when it comes to the cartridge/buildpack side of things.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#23

Post by StavrosK »

jasonkolb wrote: post #19
StavrosK wrote: post #4

I would very much like to use Docker/containers to provision and deploy my software stacks on a beefy server I have. The ideal for me would be a whole VM in a container (nginx/uwsgi/redis/postgres/etc), but Docker can't currently do that (it only runs a single process). Is there a practical/good way to easily do what I want, with Docker or another tool?

Just create a bootstrap shell script that can be run on any machine. At a high level here's what mine does: 1) Install git 2) Clone a repo with all of the dockerfiles in it (each dockerfile corresponds to a container) 3) Install Docker 4) Start containers using the previously-mentioned scripts The advantage to using a shell script for this is that you can start it manually or via an automated system. All you need is…

This is what I want the Dockerfile to do for me. For some reason, I don't really want to manage all the different components' containers myself (it's added complexity).

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#24

Post by StavrosK »

windexh8er wrote: post #18
StavrosK wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's my preference as well, I just prefer upstart to supervisord. Does anyone know how to start it offhand? It's probably just as easy as running the upstart daemon. EDIT: Well, supervisord looks straightforward, and you only need a single config file for everything. You have swayed me, thank you for that. This will do perfectly, I will try it today.

Can't edit on mobile, but here's the example referenced: https://github.com/dotcloud/collectd-graphite?files=1

Fantastic, thank you. This is the approach I'll follow, and that looks very well structured.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#25

Post by drdaeman »

They're removing dependency on AuFS because it's not enterprisey enough, but if compared to Docker (which, in my personal opinion, is very immature and lacks almost everything you'd expect from the container virtualization management tool except for the basic features, although there are, indeed, some workarounds for some cases) AuFS is granddad-level mature.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#26

Post by gabrtv »

drdaeman wrote: post #25

They're removing dependency on AuFS because it's not enterprisey enough, but if compared to Docker (which, in my personal opinion, is very immature and lacks almost everything you'd expect from the container virtualization management tool except for the basic features, although there are, indeed, some workarounds for some cases) AuFS is granddad-level mature.

Actually they're removing AuFS because it has awkward kernel dependencies and prevents Docker from running across all Linux distros. The move to device-mapper layers means Docker no longer requires a 3.8 kernel or an AuFS patch.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#27

Post by shykes »

yackob03 wrote: post #21
alexlarsson wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The process docker runs in the container can be /sbin/init, which spawns an entire OS. Its just not how its normally used.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but as far as I know Docker actually does run a binary called /sbin/init, it's just that they've replaced it in the base images with something that is more suited for fast startup times and running of a single process. Setting the Docker start command to init will probably not accomplish what you want.

That was true in earlier versions of Docker, but has been fixed. alexlarsson is correct :)

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#28

Post by drdaeman »

gabrtv wrote: post #26
drdaeman wrote: post #25

They're removing dependency on AuFS because it's not enterprisey enough, but if compared to Docker (which, in my personal opinion, is very immature and lacks almost everything you'd expect from the container virtualization management tool except for the basic features, although there are, indeed, some workarounds for some cases) AuFS is granddad-level mature.

Actually they're removing AuFS because it has awkward kernel dependencies and prevents Docker from running across all Linux distros. The move to device-mapper layers means Docker no longer requires a 3.8 kernel or an AuFS patch.

I haden't any problems with running AuFS on "stable" 2.6.x kernels (on Debian, Arch and Gentoo, and can't see why other general-purpose distros won't work) several years ago. I read, due to not being a part of kernel itself, it has problems with keeping up-to-date with very recent (3.10/3.12) kernels, but that's about it.

Not sure if enterprises wants to run the very bleeding edge software for sustainable mission-critical business-to-consumer yada yada.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#29

Post by peterwwillis »

> with Docker as a standard you will have a fully portable application that behaves exactly the same on one PaaS as it doesn’t on another

I wish this lie would go away. You have plenty of dependencies with a Docker app and it's trivial to either be missing them or have conflicting ones. Go ahead and copy some binaries from one random Linux distro three years ago to one made today and see if they work every time; not every chroot environment is backwards (or forwards) compatible.

While we're talking about "standards", can't we agree that LXC is still the simplest and most portable 'standard' for running Linux containers? Everyone wants a cool branded wrapper with an API, but LXC has the bare metal functionality that you need and costs you less container-specific maintenance.

Re: Docker + Red Hat OpenShift = The Tipping Point for Open PaaS?

#30

Post by jamespo »

drdaeman wrote: post #28
gabrtv wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually they're removing AuFS because it has awkward kernel dependencies and prevents Docker from running across all Linux distros. The move to device-mapper layers means Docker no longer requires a 3.8 kernel or an AuFS patch.

I haden't any problems with running AuFS on "stable" 2.6.x kernels (on Debian, Arch and Gentoo, and can't see why other general-purpose distros won't work) several years ago. I read, due to not being a part of kernel itself, it has problems with keeping up-to-date with very recent (3.10/3.12) kernels, but that's about it. Not sure if enterprises wants to run the very bleeding edge software for sustainable mission-cri…

Enterprises don't, but they often do want to run Redhat or Suse
Post reply on HN