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The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

hanselman.com

21–30 of 89 posts

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#21

He's empirically wrong because I've worked with 10x developers. A few years ago I worked with a guy there whose output, productivity, and smart solutions combined with godlike C++ coding ability made him probably 100x more effective than anyone else in the place. This was in the front office at Goldman Sachs, so the rest of us weren't completely useless. He was just in a different league though. I have also worked wi…

can I ask a few questions as I am struck by this comment

- How much of his contribution would you rate as technical vs understanding the domain, understanding of the systems and seeing through explicit requirements to the underlying need (you might see where I am leading).

actually that's several questions right there.

I am just fascinated by the idea of 10x: my personal assumption is it is like professional football stars - there are those who are paid 1000x, who probably win 10x but as athletes and players will be only a fraction of x better than the lowliest professional player and into the Sunday leagues.

However in these fraction of x cases other things come to play - like coach, team spirit, team quality, tactics etc. and in the software field I expect a similar disjunction to occur - knowing the system under maintenance perfectly, understanding / influencing the business requirements, as much as raw technical ability.

for example David Beckham is probably 10x player compared to say a professional in the first division. this does not mean he scores 10x as much or retains possession 10x or any other metric you like. but that teams with him in win 10x because of the leverage of the in tease in ability he does have.

and leverage is out of this world in software.

so just interested - is your ex-Collegue a david Beckham of c++ ? or is he truly a god?

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#22
post #10

Collaboration overhead. If you replace 10 average programmers with 1 good programmer he doesn't need 10x productivity to match the combined productivity of 10 programmers (which is not a sum). On top of that, programming productivity is also a qualitative measure that goes beyond feature X working correctly. One person can code it in such a way that every time it needs changing it's easy to work with - thus saves unc…

"Some people are stronger than you, some people are better coders than you - it's OK. " What some people fail to get is that coders have over human powers. A strong person can't surpass human limits. He can't lift a car with his hands. But a person with a machine can. You can't short all the words in a book as a person, but a machine can in less than a tenth of a second.

Typo. Should be: You can't SORT all the words...

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#23

It doesn't take a "rockstar" or a "ninja" or "guru" or what-have-you to be a significantly above average developer. Often the biggest hindrance to product quality (including performance, reliability, and usability) as well as to development velocity is technical debt. Having a team member who consistently churns out lots of new stuff of excellent quality is great but not nearly as important as someone who is sensitiv…

Its the guys who layout the overall design, making it is easily extensible and not prone technical debt who make a software project. They may not be the most productive in producing code, but they allow others to be so.

It's usually the same guy going over others peoples code, and reducing technical debt.

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Some people are stronger than you, some people are better coders than you - it's OK. " What some people fail to get is that coders have over human powers. A strong person can't surpass human limits. He can't lift a car with his hands. But a person with a machine can. You can't short all the words in a book as a person, but a machine can in less than a tenth of a second.

Typo. Should be: You can't SORT all the words...

Maybe he really meant to reply to the Goldman Sachs comment :)

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#25
>>People love to say that a rockstar can do the work of 10 regular engineers. That's just nonsense. 9 women can't have one baby in a month, and 10 "rockstar" developers can't replace 100 regular ones.

A somewhat confusing attempt to use the 9 women analogy here - it doesn't prove the author's point in any way.

I've worked with rockstar coders and engineers and my empirical experience suggests he's wrong.

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#26
After reading numerous posts on the subject of 10x software engineers, I reckon they fall mostly into two categories:

- `I have worked with / seen code of such ones' (often examples follow)

- `there were no such ones on any team I ever managed', with OP falling into this category.

Which is to say, the existence (or absence) of 10x software engineers appears to be party recognition problem -- managers do not want to believe one `rockstar' is responsible for most of team's output.

The other part, is the sampling bias: managers don't get to work with the Torvalds, Bellards, etc. Such software engineers often don't need to be, or aren't managed while producing their most important code. Neither they do respond to ``we are hiring rockstars'' types of job ads...

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#27
post #26

After reading numerous posts on the subject of 10x software engineers, I reckon they fall mostly into two categories: - `I have worked with / seen code of such ones' (often examples follow) - `there were no such ones on any team I ever managed' , with OP falling into this category. Which is to say, the existence (or absence) of 10x software engineers appears to be party recognition problem -- managers do not want to…

There also seems to be some ideological motivation for claiming rockstars don't exist.

The existence of rockstars provides fodder for individualist ideologies. Many people are more collectivist, so therefore feel the need to dispute the existence of rockstars. This is a little bit evident here - you need a rockstar team, with diversity. It's far more evident in the last post on this same topic.

(Not quite a dupe, but it might as well be. https://medium.com/about-work/6aedba30ecfe )

Amusingly, it's also a very corporate philosophy. "No programmer is worth more than any other, therefore to advance you must enter management." Tends to be self selecting in such corporations, since everyone who isn't mediocre leaves.

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#29
post #26

After reading numerous posts on the subject of 10x software engineers, I reckon they fall mostly into two categories: - `I have worked with / seen code of such ones' (often examples follow) - `there were no such ones on any team I ever managed' , with OP falling into this category. Which is to say, the existence (or absence) of 10x software engineers appears to be party recognition problem -- managers do not want to…

There also seems to be some ideological motivation for claiming rockstars don't exist. The existence of rockstars provides fodder for individualist ideologies. Many people are more collectivist, so therefore feel the need to dispute the existence of rockstars. This is a little bit evident here - you need a rockstar team, with diversity . It's far more evident in the last post on this same topic. (Not quite a dupe, bu…

> No programmer is worth more than any other

I don't think that's what's being said. IMHO the message is:

- No programmer is worth 10x the average. (though some might be worth 1/10 * the average).

- A high-functioning team is more important than a high-functioning individual, and these two are sometimes at odds if you give free rein to the "individualist ideologies".

Both are debatable and IMHO are often true, but "No programmer is worth more than any other", i.e. "all programmers have exactly the same worth" is not Hanselman's point. It is an corporate anti-pattern.

"each person has different strengths and weaknesses and is growing at their own rate" is recognised implicitly in a healthy working environment. Whether management gets it or not.

Re: The Myth of the Rockstar Programmer

#30
post #16

I disagree strongly. I created a software company, I have an amazing team, I know a little about this. Rockstars programmers exist and they do because they can do machines do work for them, instead of having five people do the work the can do the code 5x to 100x or 1000x faster. They could automate almost everything, even coding(creating new languages when needed specially for the task) and debugging itself, creating…

> Rockstars programmers exist Of course they do. The laws of probability ensure that. People and their traits usually follow a normal ("bell curve") distribution. Some individuals are at +2.5 standard deviations, and some even at +3.0 but they are rare. Using the table from http://www.mathsisfun.com/data/standard-normal-distribution-... we can get some nice numbers to show just how rare they are. A +2.5 developer is…

You're mistaken about the laws of probability. The normal distribution arises from sums of the same distribution. This is most frequently found in sample averages, which is . More accurately, sample averages follow a student T distribution, which converges to a normal distribution as sample size increases to infinity.

In general, humans do not follow a bell curve for complex traits. For instance, it's common to see bimodal/multimodal distributions when there are major demographic differences in the population such as gender, race, economic class, etc. Standardized tests have bell-curves because they are "normed." Experimental questions are thrown out if they are not correlated very well with the result.

Also based on the Chebyshev's inequality, +2 std dev has a minimum percentile of 75%. +2.5 has a minimum percentile of 84%. +3 has a minimum percentile of 89%. +k has a minimum percentile of 1-(1/k^2)

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