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Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

guardian.co.uk

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Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#21

Post by peterkelly »

bbwharris wrote: post #11
napoleoncomplex wrote: post #4

Guantanamo Bay is one of the most disgusting institutions in the "civilized world". How is this acceptable? Treating humans as garbage, no trial, just meat stored for torture. Every day this piece of shit prison is open is a god damn disgrace for the entire human race.

While I agree it is a disgrace, what do you plan to do with the detainees? If they weren't "terrorists" before, they most likely are now. Think about it, that's the real problem. I'm not defending it, I think it should be closed too. These humans have been subjected to complete hell.

One idea would be to bring them on to American soil and treat them under the same conditions as those held in US jails and in accordance with US law, instead of doing it in Cuba of all places.

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#22

Post by peterkelly »

skore wrote: post #6
BellsOnSunday wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Next time vote for someone who definitely, honest-to-god promises to close it if they get in. Of course, you might have done that last time as well...

Indeed. Obama blaming congress today is, unfortunately, a case of plausible deniability.

"Yes we could've"

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#23

Post by StavrosK »

Ovid wrote: post #3
herge wrote: post #2

Recently read a headline I could not believe was not from The Onion: "Guantanamo Bay Prisoners force fed at night during Ramadan"

It's horrifying. Might as well force-feed them pork. And the US knows that this is illegal, too: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/jun/05/forcefee...

No, they force-fed them at night, which is when they could eat. It's still fucked up, but at least it's not a sin.

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#24

Post by speeder »

DanBC wrote: post #20
cabalamat wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they want to die, why not jut let them?

Taking innocent taxi drivers, subjecting them to the "gift of democracy" that is extraordinary rendition and torture while being detained without trial or charge is already an effective recruiting tool for terrorists. Allowing the detainees to kill themselves turns them into martyrs, and becomes even more effective at turning people to violence. Don't forget that this behaviour just shifts the curve of moderateness t…

US people don't realize how much US is hated... They are force fed so much propaganda on how US are heroes that go around the world saving people from evil, that they don't understand for example why lots of Brazillians cheered 9/11 (yes, Brazillians CHEERED 9/11, some even threw parties, the US people I knew that were here in Brazil acted very confused, not understanding at all why people would be happy that 10 thousand "good people" died)

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#26

Post by madaxe »

rayiner wrote: post #17
napoleoncomplex wrote: post #4

Guantanamo Bay is one of the most disgusting institutions in the "civilized world". How is this acceptable? Treating humans as garbage, no trial, just meat stored for torture. Every day this piece of shit prison is open is a god damn disgrace for the entire human race.

Guantanamo has better conditions than most prisons. The "torture" happens elsewhere. You think a regular prison wouldn't engage in force feeding if prisoners went on hunger strike? See: http://wagingnonviolence.org/feature/guantanamo-is-not-an-an... . The problem with Guantanamo isn't the conditions. Its the legal limbo the prisoners are caught in.

Not in the UK they wouldn't, no. Only in your barbarous country do such things (legally) happen in prisons. We recently had a debate over Ian Brady staying in a mental prison vs. prison prison, as under psychiatric care they can force feed you, but not in prison.

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#27

Post by DanBC »

madaxe wrote: post #26
rayiner wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Guantanamo has better conditions than most prisons. The "torture" happens elsewhere. You think a regular prison wouldn't engage in force feeding if prisoners went on hunger strike? See: http://wagingnonviolence.org/feature/guantanamo-is-not-an-an... . The problem with Guantanamo isn't the conditions. Its the legal limbo the prisoners are caught in.

Not in the UK they wouldn't, no. Only in your barbarous country do such things (legally) happen in prisons. We recently had a debate over Ian Brady staying in a mental prison vs. prison prison, as under psychiatric care they can force feed you, but not in prison.

And only a limited number of people with mental health problems can be force fed.

The person needs to be detained under section of the mental health act, and to lack capacity to make the decision.

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#28

Post by thufry »

madaxe wrote: post #26
rayiner wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Guantanamo has better conditions than most prisons. The "torture" happens elsewhere. You think a regular prison wouldn't engage in force feeding if prisoners went on hunger strike? See: http://wagingnonviolence.org/feature/guantanamo-is-not-an-an... . The problem with Guantanamo isn't the conditions. Its the legal limbo the prisoners are caught in.

Not in the UK they wouldn't, no. Only in your barbarous country do such things (legally) happen in prisons. We recently had a debate over Ian Brady staying in a mental prison vs. prison prison, as under psychiatric care they can force feed you, but not in prison.

So they would let you die? I'm not sure that's clearly more humane.

Re: Yasiin Bey (aka Mos Def) force-fed under standard Guantánamo Bay procedure

#30

Post by PavlovsCat »

rayiner wrote: post #17
napoleoncomplex wrote: post #4

Guantanamo Bay is one of the most disgusting institutions in the "civilized world". How is this acceptable? Treating humans as garbage, no trial, just meat stored for torture. Every day this piece of shit prison is open is a god damn disgrace for the entire human race.

Guantanamo has better conditions than most prisons. The "torture" happens elsewhere. You think a regular prison wouldn't engage in force feeding if prisoners went on hunger strike? See: http://wagingnonviolence.org/feature/guantanamo-is-not-an-an... . The problem with Guantanamo isn't the conditions. Its the legal limbo the prisoners are caught in.

You have a point in that torture happens elsewhere, too.

But there is still the difference between torturing people in your prisons for things they allegedly did in your country, with charges and sometimes (rarely though) a trial even -- and just kidnapping them from all over the world, and then treating them so badly that just this bad treatment is argument enough for some people to accept that Guantanamo needs to stay open.

Also:

http://www.google.de/search?q=guantanamo+detainees&tbm=isch vs. http://www.google.de/search?q=prison+inmates&tbm=isch

http://www.loonwatch.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/prisoner...

^ You're not going to tell me that's just because the fashion sense that developed in Guantanamo is quirky that way? That this doesn't make your stomach turn?

> The problem with Guantanamo isn't the conditions. Its the legal limbo the prisoners are caught in.

Why can't it both be a problem? If Guantamo was a luxury hotel, we would envy the legal limbo. This is like saying something isn't torture, because "the" torture is happening elsewhere.

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