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Distributed Everything

medium.com

21–30 of 121 posts

Re: Distributed Everything

#21
The real problem with little distributed websites is attention. The same problem websites had since the 90's. How to get indexed by search engines. How to be go to places.

Poogle Glus, F*book, Shitter are tools for managing attention. Who is paying attention to you? Random visitors or people from your address/contact book? How easy is it to get? On Facebook everyone can get a few likes. On old websites you dig through analytics to figure out if someone liked it.

It seems hopeless to spread new tools for publishing and uncensored networks when there's little commercial advantage to them. They'll be used by furry porn enthusiasts and freedom fighters. But you still have to fix the problems of discoverability and attention for regular users to adopt them en masse.

A distributed web that would be used by enough people still has to have all the features people came to love in FB/Poogle+/Twitter/Google Search Bubble. Many freedom fighters ignore this reality and seem nostalgic for the bare bones sites of the 90's but easier to publish.

Today's centralized networks are hacks that exist because the fundamental design of the web was ill conceived in the 90's.

Re: Distributed Everything

#22
post #12
post #2

Brilliant article. There's a great list of current-gen distributed things towards the end, but we still need people who make things to keep making non-centralized usable platforms. Get us out of gmail-istan and fadbook-istan and hn-monsterator-istans. Give us our nerdependence back.

Google has been relatively "good" to us, the users, so far, and they've even been our allies in some cases(SOPA, ITU). But make no mistake, when the Internet will start a trend towards fully decentralized/more anonymous services, they will become our enemy , because that will endanger their very way of making a revenue. If I were a Google boss I'd try to start making money from other business models besides ads as so…

I agree with your point, but think your wording sidesteps the issue. Google has been our allies because the same things that we were against (IE a closed internet) directly endanger their revenue. They won't change their attitude when they see a huge threat to their revenue, although we may notice that their motives have always been revenue, and that does not necessarily align with ours.

Additionally, I'm not sure decentralized/anonymous services are necessarily a bad thing for Google. At the moment they have alot of competition from site like Facebook, and online shops and such. However, they are still the gateway to the internet, and are probably in the best posistion to continue to provide targeted advertising in the new age of anonymous internet. Consider the value of having your shop get a prefered listing everytime someone searches for shoes. The value of this would go up when your ability to do directed advertising through other means goes down.

Also, even with anonymous services, information still leaks, and the larger you are the better you can take advantage of it.

Re: Distributed Everything

#23
Unfortunately, even if you run a VPS on DigitalOcean or Linode or the like, you are still using a very centralized service. These services concentrate many servers in a few data centers. The US data centers are mostly on the coasts, though Linode has one in Dallas. Sure, this is efficient, but efficiency has its downsides.

I think we need at least one competent web hosting provider operating in every state of the US, and more for the large states.

Re: Distributed Everything

#25

I think while there's a valid point in here, it strikes me as kind of harsh towards the larger public, which has never heard of IRC … for a reason. It's a great service, but it's a bit much for the non-technical. Which is why it's essentially stayed around as more of a backchannel than anything else. Anyway … While there is certainly excitement in the world of the distributed and it's very much worth encouraging, wri…

> It's a great service, but it's a bit much for the non-technical.

IRC was full of non-technical people in the 90s. #teenchat was consistently the most popular channel on a number of networks! IRC used to be filled with the sort of inane chatter that seams to be the bread-and-butter of services like Twitter and Facebook. :)

Re: Distributed Everything

#26
post #20

He is missing an important point here that is well illustrated by his coffee metaphor: I don't go to Starbucks, but I don't make my espresso drinks at home either -- I go to smaller coffee shops for two things: convenience, which he acknowledges, and what he ignores -- specialized expertise. I could spend time learning how to make a good latte or mocha at home, but right now I don't want to; I have better things to d…

A small coffee shop would align with the author's intent. The post favors distribution over centralization; federation, so long as it's into small-enough chunks, tends to do the same thing.

But at the moment, Medium is a small(er) platform. If my local coffee shop does a hugely successful business and is pushed by the market or management decisions to resemble the Starbucks he describes, I will probably find a new one.

I don't understand why the author thinks Medium is already Starbucks just cause of its pedigree -- if Jerry Baldwin or Gordon Bowker (Ev Williams) started a new coffee shop, partially cause they were dissatisfied with what Starbucks (Blogger) had become, I think I'd be willing to give it a try at least. But maybe that makes me foolish.

Re: Distributed Everything

#27

I think while there's a valid point in here, it strikes me as kind of harsh towards the larger public, which has never heard of IRC … for a reason. It's a great service, but it's a bit much for the non-technical. Which is why it's essentially stayed around as more of a backchannel than anything else. Anyway … While there is certainly excitement in the world of the distributed and it's very much worth encouraging, wri…

> It's a great service, but it's a bit much for the non-technical. IRC was full of non-technical people in the 90s. #teenchat was consistently the most popular channel on a number of networks! IRC used to be filled with the sort of inane chatter that seams to be the bread-and-butter of services like Twitter and Facebook. :)

The teen chatters of the world—the ones who set the cultural trends—got a handle on it, but did their parents? :)

Re: Distributed Everything

#28
Have you considered that, perhaps, the reason facebook is full of people with nothing to say is because most people have nothing to say?

I don't actually think that's the case, or at least it's not the sole reason, there are many features that facebook has that linked pages crawled by google or whatever don't: A social reward structure, reduction of potential meaningful criticism, content aggregation - that last one's a big one by the way, there hasn't been content aggregation through an even vaguely visually pleasing interface before.

The best push-based content aggregation outside of the social networks is still RSS - a fact so sad it almost makes me want to weep.

And then there's the problem with reputation metrics still being totally screwed to hell to the point where your friends list is still a reasonable shot at people you'll trust. Which is just >_> Yeahhhh.

Don't get me wrong. I think that centralised publication systems constitute a serious threat to freedom of speech, and perhaps more importantly to the likely level of speech - facebook et al tend to be set up to discourage discussion - but I think there are non-trivial technical and social issues that feed into its popularity beyond people not knowing how to set up their own websites.

Re: Distributed Everything

#29
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't follow? I think you're thinking it means quitting jobs and working unsupported? It doesn't have to go that far. Try making things in your free time under fast-feedback constraints. Post half completed things to HN, tell the haters to fuckoff, and email your supporters to build up a coalition of the not willing to be datamined anymore. We know they know more about us than we know they know. We need to truncate…

I wasn't clear. I mean that eventually, we'll want our non-hacker family and friends to leave Facebook, Gmail, etc. and join us on the decentralized Internet.

Oooh. I see. That's why I italicized useful in the original comment. We haven't cracked usable distributed systems for the masses except for the original Skype system.

I don't have any answers here, but we can abstract away the scary parts, throw some memes and pictures that timeout on top, then take over the world.

Re: Distributed Everything

#30

Have you considered that, perhaps, the reason facebook is full of people with nothing to say is because most people have nothing to say? I don't actually think that's the case, or at least it's not the sole reason, there are many features that facebook has that linked pages crawled by google or whatever don't: A social reward structure, reduction of potential meaningful criticism, content aggregation - that last one'…

There is this great quote attributed to Mark Twain:

"If you have nothing to say, say nothing."

The current state of the internet is quite far from this: we are all encouraged to say something, anything. Here on HN it is quite far from this, but most on the traffic on the social networks I believe can be related to "dumb shit".

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