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Google's Driverless Future

reason.com

21–30 of 56 posts

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#21

A person in security told me that a big fear they have is car bombs. You would now be able to send groups of cars to a location without risking human life. That us good enough reason to not want self driving cars. I still think some of the functionality can be used for accident prevention.

Because setting up a remote control car with a camera is currently impossible?

That's trivially easy in comparison to forcing an autonomous car to do something dangerous.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#22
post #19
post #14

Anyone using Google Now is already sending all the data that constitutes the article's undesirable dystopic vision to Google. And anyone running Android, I suppose, could get an update that began surreptitiously phoning home data. If that's a thing Google wanted to start doing. Short of being in a faraday cage, we also already know cell phones have a habit of not really rendering you 'untrackable' even when lay users…

Most of your points are great, but I just want to point out that it is not true that your phone can be tracked when it is turned off. That's a misconception that is propagated by a few very poorly written articles that misinterpreted some comments in a court case. No power = no tracking.

Isn't the point that not all phones are truly off when the user thinks they're off? i.e. if you can ensure there's no power (removed battery) you can be confident there's no tracking. But if you can't ensure it...

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#23
post #19
post #14

Anyone using Google Now is already sending all the data that constitutes the article's undesirable dystopic vision to Google. And anyone running Android, I suppose, could get an update that began surreptitiously phoning home data. If that's a thing Google wanted to start doing. Short of being in a faraday cage, we also already know cell phones have a habit of not really rendering you 'untrackable' even when lay users…

Most of your points are great, but I just want to point out that it is not true that your phone can be tracked when it is turned off. That's a misconception that is propagated by a few very poorly written articles that misinterpreted some comments in a court case. No power = no tracking.

You need to actually remove the battery. Apparently software can make the phone "appear" off but not actually be off.

http://news.cnet.com/2100-1029_3-6140191.html

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#24
When weighing the balance between even through the lens that this article presents, the driverless car is still a net good. Google potentially knowing if I have cancer is an ok exchange if it reduces the very real chance of death, injury or legal problems that my commute presents me every day.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#25
post #23
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of your points are great, but I just want to point out that it is not true that your phone can be tracked when it is turned off. That's a misconception that is propagated by a few very poorly written articles that misinterpreted some comments in a court case. No power = no tracking.

You need to actually remove the battery. Apparently software can make the phone "appear" off but not actually be off. http://news.cnet.com/2100-1029_3-6140191.html

That's exactly the bad article that started the misconception.

This is a case where you need to let common sense override your trust in journalists. You are probably smarter than them, you know more about tech and phones than them, don't trust them when they write stuff that doesn't make sense. Even if it were true don't you think some hacker woud have verified it by now? Offered a hack to stop it? They haven't because the article is dumb and wrong, and CNet should retract it. I'll cite the source cnet lazily misinterpreted if you give me a minute.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#26
post #22
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of your points are great, but I just want to point out that it is not true that your phone can be tracked when it is turned off. That's a misconception that is propagated by a few very poorly written articles that misinterpreted some comments in a court case. No power = no tracking.

Isn't the point that not all phones are truly off when the user thinks they're off? i.e. if you can ensure there's no power (removed battery) you can be confident there's no tracking. But if you can't ensure it...

You are conflating a hypothetical with a real claim. it is hypothetically possible, but it isn't actually true. And you can ensure in many ways. Like measuring the power usage when your phone is off. Like looking at the source code of the operating system.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#27
post #25
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need to actually remove the battery. Apparently software can make the phone "appear" off but not actually be off. http://news.cnet.com/2100-1029_3-6140191.html

That's exactly the bad article that started the misconception. This is a case where you need to let common sense override your trust in journalists. You are probably smarter than them, you know more about tech and phones than them, don't trust them when they write stuff that doesn't make sense. Even if it were true don't you think some hacker woud have verified it by now? Offered a hack to stop it? They haven't becau…

Here is the original source, the court memorandum. You can see how grossly irresponsible/lazy/stupid Cnet was.

Note that it is VERY clear that the government is asking to install a physical bug into a phone that works when the phone is off. It has nothign to do with the inherent hardware of the phone.

http://ny.findacase.com/research/wfrmDocViewer.aspx/xq/fac.2...

Judge Jones granted the application, authorizing continued interception at the four restaurants and the installation of a listening device in Ardito's cellular telephone. The device functioned whether the phone was powered on or off, intercepting conversations within its range wherever it happened to be.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#28
I don't know about other people, but I would use a driverless car just for the countless hours it would save me from sitting behind the wheel wasting my time either stuck in traffic, waiting at stop lights, or just plain driving from point A to point B. I don't know how much time the average American spends behind the wheel in a lifetime, but this reason alone would be enough, not to mention the decrease in accidents.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#29
post #3

It's going to take a long time to get people comfortable with driverless cars. In the meantime, can the technology be immediately converted to "assisted" driving to help avoid collisions, crossing the center line, etc.? Make it a lot harder for people to "bump" into each other. We might be able to get some of the benefits of driverless cars sooner.

Maybe some people won't be comfortable with driverless cars at first, but I'm guessing at least 10% of the cars on the road will be driverless within 10 years. Regardless of how people feel about it, once the actuaries get some data to crunch on liability regarding driverless cars, it'll quickly become more expensive to insure your own car than a driverless one.

Re: Google's Driverless Future

#30
I can only take an example from my own life: I'm a licensed motorcycle rider, I use it as my primary form of transportation when it's over 50F rain or shine. Being a motorcycle rider, I can never get a ticket for not wearing a seat belt, or driving with all of my doors open (silly analogy, I know). All of these safety devices don't apply and riding a bike requires substantially more skill and practice than the weekend course required in most US states to receive a license. Arguably it is an incredibly dangerous way to travel compared with driving or riding in a car and it's still legal.

I wonder if the guy/gal of the future who decides they want to reject driver-less cars won't resemble the modern motorcycle rider in this way. I can see those of us who love our motorcycles standing up for (and probably being) supporters of "driver's rights". I made that up, but a similar movement among riders resulted in my state lifting the mandatory helmet law despite outrage from non-riders. I can't imagine the state getting away with banning motorcycles. I don't believe it'll have enough support to ban drivers in a driver-less majority world.

The other issue is one of need for such legislation. The author states that the automobile stands as one of history’s great amplifiers of personal autonomy and liberty. Liberating? For some of us, but probably not most of us. I think more people see it as a tool to get from their home in suburbia to work/kids to baseball practice. Most people see driving as something they have to do rather than want to do and will be happy to get rid of the chore if the price was right. Those of us who do find it liberating will be part of an enthusiast market that has always existed for both cars and motorcycles. We'll be the ones taking the most risk and consequences for taking that risk, while the driver-less passenger will, arguably, be much safer.

EDIT: Grammer/structure. Boo

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