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Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

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21–30 of 75 posts

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#21

So there's this puzzle that people enjoy thinking about regarding space travel. Say that it finally becomes possible to reach a planet of a nearby star. It's a new technology that enables it, and we can build a spaceship that will support several generations of people during the trip. Maybe it takes 500 years to get there. Well, 500 years is a long time. It's not as if our technological development will stop in the m…

[deleted]

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#22
post #7
post #3

In 2030-2050, passenger rail will be obsolete. Self-driving cars will surpass them on every metric. After AI* obsoletes physical safety as an engineering problem, cars will shrink to tiny, weightless pieces of plastic most closely approximating today's motorcycles. And following Jevon's paradox, the massive efficiency gains will push economic driving to extreme speeds. As fast as bullet trains, without the timetables…

The idea that in 20 years we'll have self-driving cars on any substantial scale is totally ridiculous. If I had to bet money, we won't even have a substantial electric car deployment by then, much less self-driving cars. Also: the physics of high-speed cars makes the concept of cars traveling as fast as bullet trains totally ridiculous. The fact that a car is self-driving doesn't change the physics of tire/road frict…

We'll certainly have electric cars on a substantial scale by 2033, and it's likely we'll have self-driving cars deployed in some significant contexts (long distance freeway travel) by then.

Social forces will drive the former, economic forces will drive the latter.

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#23
post #9

So there's this puzzle that people enjoy thinking about regarding space travel. Say that it finally becomes possible to reach a planet of a nearby star. It's a new technology that enables it, and we can build a spaceship that will support several generations of people during the trip. Maybe it takes 500 years to get there. Well, 500 years is a long time. It's not as if our technological development will stop in the m…

But the argument for high-speed rail isn't that it will serve as a stopgap measure until we have self-driving cars, it is that a railroad train is vastly more efficient than any imaginable car technology. Railroad trains are very energy-efficient, compared to cars driving along a road, or even trucks driving along a road. And if we suddenly had self-driving cars, packed close together and safer than the existing syst…

In addition to your point, high speed rail can also carry cargo as well as passengers.

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#24

First we need to fix regular passenger rail in this country. As long as interstate passenger rail is controlled by the Amtrak monopoly, and its attendant unions, rail travel in America will continue to fall behind the rest of the world. There's not even regular rail service between most major US cities 3-8 hours apart, even though tracks exist and demand would exist if trains ran as fast as driving.

Freight is a big problem. They own the rails; Amtrak is a guest.

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#25
post #13

So there's this puzzle that people enjoy thinking about regarding space travel. Say that it finally becomes possible to reach a planet of a nearby star. It's a new technology that enables it, and we can build a spaceship that will support several generations of people during the trip. Maybe it takes 500 years to get there. Well, 500 years is a long time. It's not as if our technological development will stop in the m…

Infrastructure technology progresses extremely slowly, in a way I think is hard for people used to the progress in computer technology to understand. Most electricity in the U.S. is still produced by coal power, in plants that usually aren't dramatically more efficient than they were a century ago. 2050 is 37 years from now. 37 years ago was 1976. Most of the transit infrastructure we use today was already built by 1…

37 years prior to 1976 was 1939, when none of the interstate highway system was built. By 1976, it was largely in place as we know it today.

Infrastructure does not always move slowly. When it's time, it actually moves quite quickly.

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#26
This is from a few weeks ago and is basically one guy's fantasy based on not much facts. The real current plans are much more about small regional networks that connect places people want to go rather than rail geek porn that just connects everything because it looks nicer on the map.

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#27
post #7
post #3

In 2030-2050, passenger rail will be obsolete. Self-driving cars will surpass them on every metric. After AI* obsoletes physical safety as an engineering problem, cars will shrink to tiny, weightless pieces of plastic most closely approximating today's motorcycles. And following Jevon's paradox, the massive efficiency gains will push economic driving to extreme speeds. As fast as bullet trains, without the timetables…

The idea that in 20 years we'll have self-driving cars on any substantial scale is totally ridiculous. If I had to bet money, we won't even have a substantial electric car deployment by then, much less self-driving cars. Also: the physics of high-speed cars makes the concept of cars traveling as fast as bullet trains totally ridiculous. The fact that a car is self-driving doesn't change the physics of tire/road frict…

The auto industry is saying that fully self-driving cars will be on the market in ten years. The safety and entertainment benefits are enormous. Bullet trains require an entirely new track infrastructure, whereas self driving cars are an obvious upgrade to the existing auto infrastructure (which is already 1000x more popular than rail).

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#28
post #9

So there's this puzzle that people enjoy thinking about regarding space travel. Say that it finally becomes possible to reach a planet of a nearby star. It's a new technology that enables it, and we can build a spaceship that will support several generations of people during the trip. Maybe it takes 500 years to get there. Well, 500 years is a long time. It's not as if our technological development will stop in the m…

But the argument for high-speed rail isn't that it will serve as a stopgap measure until we have self-driving cars, it is that a railroad train is vastly more efficient than any imaginable car technology. Railroad trains are very energy-efficient, compared to cars driving along a road, or even trucks driving along a road. And if we suddenly had self-driving cars, packed close together and safer than the existing syst…

The reality is not quite that simple, you need to consider the energy required by and environmental impact of building out and maintaining a high speed rail infrastructure. Rail efficiency is also highly sensitive to occupancy, a train carrying a small number of passengers could well be less efficient than transporting that number of people by auto. And cars are getting more fuel efficient as well

And if the government is involved, forget about it. It will be a massive mess of cost overruns and other financial shenanigans. And Amtrak proves that the government can't even run a railroad, let alone build one.

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#29

Historically I have been a big supporter of trains in the US. Recently, I have decided that the cost may not be worth the benefit if future technology is considered. The future is going to involve self driving busses, self driving cars, self driving trucks etc. The primary thing I enjoy about the train is the additional space. Fundmantally, that is the problem with trains too. If they jammed people on a train the way…

I don't think busses, self driving or not, could ever compete with high speed trains. I have yet to see a bus driving 220 mph on a street crowded with other cars, busses and trucks.

And that will be even more true if the US decides that 220 mph is too slow (because it is just as fast as everyone else) and they might want to skip that milestone and go for 350 mph maglev trains ;-)

Re: Map Shows Where 220mph Trains Would Go in the U.S.

#30
post #9

So there's this puzzle that people enjoy thinking about regarding space travel. Say that it finally becomes possible to reach a planet of a nearby star. It's a new technology that enables it, and we can build a spaceship that will support several generations of people during the trip. Maybe it takes 500 years to get there. Well, 500 years is a long time. It's not as if our technological development will stop in the m…

But the argument for high-speed rail isn't that it will serve as a stopgap measure until we have self-driving cars, it is that a railroad train is vastly more efficient than any imaginable car technology. Railroad trains are very energy-efficient, compared to cars driving along a road, or even trucks driving along a road. And if we suddenly had self-driving cars, packed close together and safer than the existing syst…

The table is missing railroad unions-- the anti-efficiency factor that's ruined American passenger rail.
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