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Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

blog.zlemma.com

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Re: Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

#21

Post by jaxytee »

omaranto wrote: post #16
jaxytee wrote: post #4

"Yes, Scala has Lift but it can’t match the maturity of Django. This overrode the benefits of some of the other libraries/tools that Scala/Java have on offer. Python gets ahead again: 2-1." How does one come to the conclusion that the maturity of an 8 year old web framework, beats out the benefits of the almost 20 year old battle tested Java ecosystem. Not to mention the Scala Ecosystem is included as Icing on the JV…

Wait, are you comparing the ages of Django and Java? Wouldn't it be fairer to compare the ages of Python and Java? Python is about four years older than Java.

I'm referring to the comparison made by OP.

Re: Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

#22

Post by jaxytee »

mhaymo wrote: post #8
jaxytee wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On that same note, most of the Django ecosystem isn't as mature as Django either. What point are your trying to make?

You can't claim that Scala is more mature than Python just because it's built on the (very mature) JVM. You have to look at the tools you will actually be using, and neither Play nor Lift are as mature as Django, nor is Scala the language as mature as Python.

I never claimed scala was more mature than Python. I'm referencing the argument OP made. You just created the illusion of me comparing Scala to Python. Read my comments if you don't believe so.

Re: Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

#23

Post by jaxytee »

cover_drive wrote: post #9
jaxytee wrote: post #4

"Yes, Scala has Lift but it can’t match the maturity of Django. This overrode the benefits of some of the other libraries/tools that Scala/Java have on offer. Python gets ahead again: 2-1." How does one come to the conclusion that the maturity of an 8 year old web framework, beats out the benefits of the almost 20 year old battle tested Java ecosystem. Not to mention the Scala Ecosystem is included as Icing on the JV…

Are you suggesting that we should go with Lift/Play instead of Django? If so, can you elaborate on your argument? As you can tell from the article, I'd love to see Scala beat Python, but I can't see Scala scoring over Python on the web framework front.

I'm not in a postion to suggest what web framework your team should go with. I think that depends on the development taste and needs of your team. My main purpose was to point out the oversite of the Play Framework in the orignal article. FYI the only interest I have in pushing Play is that of a Scala developer who has tried Play and Lift. I found Play to be more approachable and modern. Especially for developers with MVC framework experience.

Re: Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

#24

Post by ankitml »

jaxytee wrote: post #21
omaranto wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, are you comparing the ages of Django and Java? Wouldn't it be fairer to compare the ages of Python and Java? Python is about four years older than Java.

I'm referring to the comparison made by OP.

"Scala has Lift but it can’t match the maturity of Django."

Clearly 'it' here refers to Lift and not Scala/Java. Comparisons are never made between apples and oranges.

Re: Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

#25

Post by mhaymo »

jaxytee wrote: post #22
mhaymo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't claim that Scala is more mature than Python just because it's built on the (very mature) JVM. You have to look at the tools you will actually be using, and neither Play nor Lift are as mature as Django, nor is Scala the language as mature as Python.

I never claimed scala was more mature than Python. I'm referencing the argument OP made. You just created the illusion of me comparing Scala to Python. Read my comments if you don't believe so.

Well the OP is about Scala vs Python, so forgive us for assuming you were speaking on-topic.

Re: Language War - Scala versus Python (Part 2)

#26

Post by m501 »

zubinmehta wrote: post #10
jaxytee wrote: post #4

"Yes, Scala has Lift but it can’t match the maturity of Django. This overrode the benefits of some of the other libraries/tools that Scala/Java have on offer. Python gets ahead again: 2-1." How does one come to the conclusion that the maturity of an 8 year old web framework, beats out the benefits of the almost 20 year old battle tested Java ecosystem. Not to mention the Scala Ecosystem is included as Icing on the JV…

We were merely in search of a good web framework. Java has battletested libraries but so does python and a lot of other general programming languages. It still isn't answering our core question. A decision on what web framework to use has much more to do with the framework itself(its philosophy and community) than with the language it is built in. Coming to django, I would argue that it is the best documented project…

Play is definitely more akin to django than lift is. Lift, as I've read not experienced, has specific philosophy for how to build web apps that is slightly different than django or play.

I'm a long time django user. I love django. I've used it in production apps. I like to try out new languages as a hobby and so I got myself the programming in scala and the Play framework in action (manning). Just trying out Play however I can't seem to get this feeling that I could do it more easily and faster in django, though that may be because I'm comfortable with django and python. There are also a ton of django apps that I can leverage to build out parts of my app. I'm not sure about the play ecosystem in that respect.

I'm also specifically looking for advantages that the language itself can bring but since I haven't gotten very far I haven't discovered any yet but I'm hopeful that I will be pleasantly surprised.

Having said all that I just saw some play love coming from LinkedIn: http://engineering.linkedin.com/play/play-framework-linkedin

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