ASP.NET MVC 1.0 Released • Hacker News Board

Re: ASP.NET MVC 1.0 Released

#21

Post by snprbob86 » Thu, Mar 19, 2009, 8:58 PM UTC

9oliYQjP wrote: post #20

snprbob86 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linq is freaking sweet. I miss it every weekday I have to write C# 2.0 and every weekend I write Python. Anyone interested in pragmatic programming languages owe it to themselves to learn a bit about Linq and why it is so pleasant to use. The best way to learn Linq is with the 101 samples [1], but I might be bias because my friend wrote them [2]. [1] http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/vcsharp/aa336746.aspx [2] http://ww…

I haven't used Python since 2004, and never became an expert. But isn't is possible to achieve most of what LINQ does in Python? I know in Ruby it's possible to call sort with a block ( http://snippets.dzone.com/posts/show/2120 ). IMHO, that code resembles the spirit of LINQ. That's without even touching on the ActiveRecord portion of Rails which achieves a lot of what LINQ does too. There's got to be a way to do thi…

Python's generator expressions let you get the common 90% of what you would do with Linq. Generator expressions, however, quickly become awkward when nested and don't really support joining or grouping data. Python has a groupby method and similar helpers, but they simply aren't as natural as the SQL-style syntax. Also, Linq puts the object being queried first to make it toolable (IntelliSense can offer completion for members in where and select clauses, etc).

I don't know much Ruby, but I'd suspect that blocks can simulate Linq far better than Python can. However, the Lambda-inspired syntax is a bit cluttered when compared to the SQL-inspired syntax.

Linq is a feature about 3 things:

1) Correctness via static typing checks

2) Interoperability of various data backends (Microsoft provides backends for XML, SQL, and .NET objects)

3) Clean and beautiful code

Neither Python nor Ruby can provide #1 (at compile time, anyway). SqlAlchemy and other projects attempt #2, but I don't have enough experience with them to comment on their success. And while Python as a whole (and I presume Ruby) has lots of #3, complex data querying is not the most beautiful experience.

Re: ASP.NET MVC 1.0 Released

#22

Post by metachor » Thu, Mar 19, 2009, 11:30 PM UTC

wayne wrote: post #8

Awesome framework. All the quirkiness of ASP.NET is abstracted away from you (though you can still get to it if you need to). As a Rails developer you'll feel right at home with controllers, views, routing, and tests. The annoyances: - ActiveRecord has its downsides but it's easy to use and ASP.NET MVC doesn't come with a similar ORM. LINQ is awkward to learn. - It doesn't have view partials.

Try the ADO.NET Entity Framework, Microsoft's new LINQ-based ORM tool, released with Visual Studio 2008 SP1. It's very easy to use, and plays well with ASP.NET MVC.

Re: ASP.NET MVC 1.0 Released

#23

Post by noblethrasher » Fri, Mar 20, 2009, 12:37 AM UTC

cdeutmey wrote: post #17

I'm having a hard time getting excited about this. In 3 months MS will release version 1.1 and then version 2 coming 6 months after, each with version compatibility issues with the release before. Then a new flavor of the month will catch MS's attention and this will finally stabilize to the point where it can be implemented or identified as junk technology.

Maybe, but it is open source and was developed with constant feedback from the developer community so that indicates something of a new direction on the part of MS.

Re: ASP.NET MVC 1.0 Released

#24

Post by jpcx01 » Fri, Mar 20, 2009, 1:59 AM UTC

Big win for Microsoft. Though I'm skeptical about whether the VB focused ASP.net dev community will adopt this over the fundamentally broken "WebForm" piece (Microsoft hasn't taken any official position over which one is prefered).

Still, I've gone through this and its very well architected. Not going to get me to switch back to ASP.NET from Rails/Merb, but its nice to know that some people at Microsoft finally understand how to build a well built web development framework.