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Learning how to attract women to web development

devbootcamp.com

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Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#21

Post by SkyMarshal »

One of the best comments on this topic I've seen was by a girl at Stuyvesant on learning computer science:

"Before taking the mandated Intro class last year, when I heard 'computer science,' I pictured nerdy boys, who turned into nerdy bearded men, slouched over huge computers and click-clacking out codes that meant nothing to me. There’s nothing wrong with nerdy boys, comp sci just didn’t seem like something I would ever be interested in.

"This image was quickly shattered in that first intro class. Computer science started to resonate with me when I worked on my first project, creating a simple animation of a string quartet using Netlogo. It was while I was working on this that I realized comp sci isn’t about nerdy boys sitting at computers and coding out nonsense that turns into violent video games and complicated math problem solvers. No, comp sci isn’t this at all. Comp sci, as I have found in my classes at Stuy, is a medium for expression, a place for creation and creativity."

http://betabeat.com/2012/06/real-tales-of-learning-computer-...

This is both true, and probably effective for changing women's perception of the field and attracting more to it.

Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#22

Post by adamesque »

tjic wrote: post #9

> One of our goals at Dev Bootcamp Chicago is to change the ratio of women in software development: we want a 1:1 ratio in our cohorts. Why? That's a serious question. My hobbies include writing, blacksmithing, cooking, and ceramics. In writing, around half the people are women. In blacksmithing perhaps 3% are women. In cooking probably 90% of the blogs I read and people who take classes are women. In ceramics it's a…

I'm sorry, but "why?", by itself, is never a serious question.

Except in cases of extreme naivety, it's a challenge, or worse, a roadblock, posed to force a reexamination of the underlying assumption.

In this case, the underlying assumption is that the field of web development would be enhanced by a more equal ratio of women to men.

Your "why?" implies a host of reasons, bounded only by imagination, why this might not be the case — why we might be better off leaving this to the men — but luckily, you don't have to actually voice any of them.

So no, it isn't a serious question, and doesn't deserve a serious response here.

Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#24

Post by theorique »

shanelja wrote: post #2

I thought the title was 'Learning how to attract women with web development', so the article wasn't exactly what I was expecting, but still a great (if short) read. Could you elaborate further on what you did exactly to get the male attendants percentage to decrease and the effect you think it had? I'm assuming that you expected the female name to draw attention to the fact that a woman was in charge, or something si…

I thought the title was 'Learning how to attract women with web development'

Makes me think: "Hey baby, why don't we go back to my place and I'll demonstrate my database schema"

lol. silly.

Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#25

Post by cle »

amputect wrote: post #14
tjic wrote: post #9

> One of our goals at Dev Bootcamp Chicago is to change the ratio of women in software development: we want a 1:1 ratio in our cohorts. Why? That's a serious question. My hobbies include writing, blacksmithing, cooking, and ceramics. In writing, around half the people are women. In blacksmithing perhaps 3% are women. In cooking probably 90% of the blogs I read and people who take classes are women. In ceramics it's a…

Neither the OP, nor a woman, but I'll take a shot at this one since it's a fair question respectfully posed. I think that one aspect of this problem is that, due to a combination of cultural factors, women do not feel welcome at industry events, and do not feel like their input is valued, and that's absolutely something that should be addressed.

I agree that it's a problem. But I'm not convinced that merely attracting more women to web development is the solution.

As you said, the problem is that women are discriminated against in the industry. I don't think attracting more women will necessarily solve that problem. The problem is with the attitude of many of the men. Attracting more women might even make it worse. Men might start resenting them.

Fixing the attitude problem might attract more women--or it might not.

This is a good example of why I think "diversity" initiatives are missing the point. The point isn't to have equal proportions of races/sexes/nationalities/etc., the point is to ensure that they are all treated equally and justly. Many diversity movements do the exact opposite and treat people differently based on their sex or skin color. I think this is unjust and can often make problems worse, not better.

Back to the topic: I love the welcoming attitude, though. The intention is good, if a bit misguided. If more men adopted the same attitude as Dev Bootcamp, "Women, we value your contributions and will treat you as equals," then the problem would be solved.

Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#26

Post by delinka »

eranation wrote: post #12
tjic wrote: post #9

> One of our goals at Dev Bootcamp Chicago is to change the ratio of women in software development: we want a 1:1 ratio in our cohorts. Why? That's a serious question. My hobbies include writing, blacksmithing, cooking, and ceramics. In writing, around half the people are women. In blacksmithing perhaps 3% are women. In cooking probably 90% of the blogs I read and people who take classes are women. In ceramics it's a…

Why? Because I know personally very talented women who want to, and are capable of learning web development, and the mere current ratio of males in the industry is intimidating them. Web development is a profession, not (just) a hobby, and if women move away from it just due to the fact it's already a high ratio of males then it's a problem

Why do we not have the same goals for automotive mechanics? I don't personally know any women who'd want to be mechanics (but then neither do I know any women who want to be developers in any form), but I'm sure they exist. Are they also reluctant to start their dream job simply because of men? If so, that's a problem. (It also seems oddly sexist to me...)

Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#27

Post by refurb »

hagios wrote: post #19
tjic wrote: post #9

> One of our goals at Dev Bootcamp Chicago is to change the ratio of women in software development: we want a 1:1 ratio in our cohorts. Why? That's a serious question. My hobbies include writing, blacksmithing, cooking, and ceramics. In writing, around half the people are women. In blacksmithing perhaps 3% are women. In cooking probably 90% of the blogs I read and people who take classes are women. In ceramics it's a…

The question of 'why' is an important one, indeed. For example, I suspect that the disparity in cooking and ceramics is not due to a [perceived] unwelcoming culture, or a [perceived] pervasive attitude that men who are entering the field are inferior by default. It might be that women are considered inferior in blacksmithing; I'm not a blacksmith, though, so I don't know. I do know one woman who is a blacksmith, howe…

An interesting question comes from the fact that not all STEM fields are "straight white males".

Take a look biology. Back in the late 1990s, the majority of biology graduate students were female. When I was in industry, the number of females working on biology was also very close to 50%.

So why have women felt comfortable entering the field of biology when it used to be dominated by males?

There are lessons to be learned here.

Re: Learning how to attract women to web development

#30

Post by mnicole »

Jemaclus wrote: post #16

I'm not sure this has anything to do with attracting women to web development. These women were already attracted to web development -- or they wouldn't be in Girl Develop It or any of those other groups, right? This is about DevBootCamp patting themselves on the back for meeting their quota. And regardless, this whole "invite women first" thing doesn't really address the basic gender imbalance problems in the indust…

Great response. At RailsGirls PDX they asked how everyone had found out about the event. I'd found out through a female dev mailing list I'm a part of, but I was really happy to learn that many - if not most - of them had been encouraged by male co-workers, friends and significant others who knew the girl had an interest in dev or just tech, but were intimidated (even by other female developers) and thus didn't take part in existing communities.
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