"As you know people, as you learn about things, you realize that these generalizations we have are, virtually to a generalization, false. Well, except for this one, as it turns out. What you think of Oracle, is even truer than you think it is. There has been no entity in human history with less complexity or nuance to it than Oracle. And I gotta say, as someone who has seen that complexity for my entire life, it's very hard to get used to that idea. It's like, 'surely this is more complicated!' but it's like: Wow, this is really simple! This company is very straightforward, in its defense. This company is about one man, his alter-ego, and what he wants to inflict upon humanity -- that's it! ...Ship mediocrity, inflict misery, lie our asses off, screw our customers, and make a whole shitload of money. Yeah... you talk to Oracle, it's like, 'no, we don't fucking make dreams happen -- we make money!' ...You need to think of Larry Ellison the way you think of a lawnmower. You don't anthropomorphize your lawnmower, the lawnmower just mows the lawn, you stick your hand in there and it'll chop it off, the end. You don't think 'oh, the lawnmower hates me' -- lawnmower doesn't give a shit about you, lawnmower can't hate you. Don't anthropomorphize the lawnmower. Don't fall into that trap about Oracle."
-- Bryan Cantrill
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zRN7XLCRhc
Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
21–30 of 157 posts
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#22Can anyone please tell me why Oracle is doing that? I don't get it, it seems to me that the amount of unhappy people would eclipse any penny they might earn with such cheap tactics, it is not like this would give them a 10% profit increase.
Oracle don't care about happy people, and a lack of happy people dealing with Oracle has not stopped their massive profits so why would they start now? I think this is extra worse than normal bundling, because its a friggin platform! A basis for applications, it smells as bad as Microsoft asking to install a toolbar during the OS install.
I just remembered that Ubuntu ships with Amazon ads on their OS search bar...
Seriously, how worse stuff can get?
I imagine a future.
A bright future.
A future where everyone sees data, with Google Glasses like technology and beyond.
And thus, where they have ads in front of them all the time, you arrive home, look at your daughter in the crib, and suddenly your entire vision is plastered with a semi-transparent ad for diapers, and you blink, it goes away, and another shows up, a ad for automatic cribs with quad core processor and capable of singing and telling stories on its own.
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#23Maybe someone (and by "someone" I of course mean "not me!" - my own internet nerd-rage falls well short of doing this, not being much of a Windows user) should write, maintain, and SEO/social-media the hell out of a "Java crap-ware un-installer", which prominently advertises MS-SQL, SAP, and perhaps Postgres while it does it's uninstalling… Then get all the geeks to start telling their bosses "Oh, Java's hijacked you…
Crapware un-installer? Sounds more like a crapware exchanger with Postgres tacked on...
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#24Larry is saving up for another Hawaii island. Every penny counts.
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#25[Somewhat relevant, somewhat off-topic] Commission collections and ethics aside, I actually cannot understand the venom towards Ask (its search results). I believe in keeping web searches open with multiple choices made available to users, so I actively support all viable alternatives (meaning I use Ask, Blekko, ddg, lycos, yahoo (bing) among others instead of Google for regular everyday searches). Ask search results…
Ask gets money by tricking you to click on not-quite-relevent ads, whereas Google gets money by providing revelent ads, no tricking involved.
You can't really split Ask in half and talk about the quality of its search results vs the ethics of the company.
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#26Couldn't someone just build OpenJDK for Windows and offer it as an alternative install?
Because, I'll tell you what, I sure didn't get any crapware when I typed `sudo apt-get install openjdk-7-jdk`.
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#27You mean: stop bundling crapware with our crapware! Note: I have no problem with Java on the server or client, just the applet and browser plugin model.
I remember a time when java applets were cool. I don't think it's a bad idea entirely, just dated, and eclipsed by other technologies.
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
Oracle don't care about happy people, and a lack of happy people dealing with Oracle has not stopped their massive profits so why would they start now? I think this is extra worse than normal bundling, because its a friggin platform! A basis for applications, it smells as bad as Microsoft asking to install a toolbar during the OS install.
By bundling advert-ridden applications with their latest OS, Microsoft aren't really all that far off the mark from your comment.
Are these applications really bundled by Microsoft or are they pre-installed [1] by OEMs that sell Win8 with their hardware?
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#29If you're reading this, you're probably too small.
I believe ORCL wants to drive off all their nuisance D and E customers, which is all the riffraff not paying them $50m/yr. After taking over Sun, they've moved all the good stuff behind a paywall, jacked the cost of legacy products and of supporting them, added onerous contracts with stiff penalties. For example, if you ever drop support, there's a big fine to rejoin. Another example is if you're an OEM they make it very very hard to simply sell their stuff. My $work is an OEM that also uses several products ORCL bought that used to be okay, but now we're getting off them before the sleaze and expense kills us.
So Java is probably one of those standalone business units they need but hope it will make a little profit of its own. The first attempt to monetize, sue GOOG, didn't go so good if you recall.
Re: Petition: Stop bundling crapware with Java
#30Couldn't someone just build OpenJDK for Windows and offer it as an alternative install? Because, I'll tell you what, I sure didn't get any crapware when I typed `sudo apt-get install openjdk-7-jdk`.
The problem is that the OpenJDK has problems with graphical toolkits, specifically Swing. Intellij (Java IDE with a lot of Swing) runs a lot worse under the OpenJDK than under the Sun's JVM. I might be wrong, but I don't think this has changed recently.