Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

apnews.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

21–30 of 61 posts

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#21

Post by kotaKat »

nephihaha wrote: post #3

There is a grey area here of calls from businesses which the customer is signed up to, or has had previous dealings with. Many will be unsolicited but not all will be. Many of these calls are coming out of the Third World countries which are barely regulated in this regard, so good luck with enforcing it.

I'd like to see forced legislation requiring marketers to disclose the exact source and campaign they acquired your data in.

I've been getting a barage of non-stop harassment via unwanted magazine subscriptions. People Inc claims some company called "Subco" signed me up and won't allow me to cancel, only "Subco" can do that. "Subco" then claims they got my information from someone else down the line. They then blame someone else, someone else...

... and I still have no clue who the hell decided to sign me up for 20 magazines in the mail.

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#22

Post by inigyou »

gruez wrote: post #16
inigyou wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let them pay international rates. One dollar a minute, eh? If they're calling from within the EU then a cross-country judgement is still enforceable, so I assume they aren't doing that.

"International rates" aren't a thing anymore since the advent of VOIP. It doesn't matter whether you're connecting from France or Fiji, with VOIP you pay the same rate.

There are three kinds of VOIP you could be talking about.

The first kind sends your call out from a local number in the country you're calling to. So someone in France has a French number, and you can use it following French local tariffs + a bit. The owner of this number would be prosecuted if he didn't cooperate with enforcing the law.

The second way is that you use IP to connect to your own country's PSTN. Normal international rates apply.

The third is that you use a platform like WhatsApp with no relation to the PSTN. In this case I don't know how the law applies.

The fourth kind (which you are not talking about) is that your PSTN carrier privately uses IP to connect to the French PSTN carrier but it looks like PSTN on both sides.

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#23

Post by inigyou »

pixel_popping wrote: post #19
inigyou wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let them pay international rates. One dollar a minute, eh? If they're calling from within the EU then a cross-country judgement is still enforceable, so I assume they aren't doing that.

International rates are just a consumer thing.

Explain how this can exist concurrently on the front page with this, then: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49183953

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#24

Post by Pinus »

pjmlp wrote: post #6
nephihaha wrote: post #3

There is a grey area here of calls from businesses which the customer is signed up to, or has had previous dealings with. Many will be unsolicited but not all will be. Many of these calls are coming out of the Third World countries which are barely regulated in this regard, so good luck with enforcing it.

Which is why nowadays I never take calls if the prefix is from a country I don't have connections with, it is private, or doesn't map to any of my contacts. If it is someone that I actually know, they will be aware how to actually reach me.

If I remember correctly, a recent Gallup in Sweden indicated that about 25 % do not take calls from any unknown number. I don’t know whether this result has been corrected to take itself into account. :)

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#27

Post by gruez »

inigyou wrote: post #22
gruez wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"International rates" aren't a thing anymore since the advent of VOIP. It doesn't matter whether you're connecting from France or Fiji, with VOIP you pay the same rate.

There are three kinds of VOIP you could be talking about. The first kind sends your call out from a local number in the country you're calling to. So someone in France has a French number, and you can use it following French local tariffs + a bit. The owner of this number would be prosecuted if he didn't cooperate with enforcing the law. The second way is that you use IP to connect to your own country's PSTN. Normal…

At least in the US, VOIP providers (think google voice or twilio) interconnect with telephone companies similar to how landline/cellphone companies interconnect with each other, so #1 and #4 are essentially the same. The only difference is what the "from" number appears as. If you look at the price lists of voip providers, you'll note that the only factor that determines the price is where you're calling to, not where you're calling from.

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#28

Post by throw-the-towel »

nephihaha wrote: post #3

There is a grey area here of calls from businesses which the customer is signed up to, or has had previous dealings with. Many will be unsolicited but not all will be. Many of these calls are coming out of the Third World countries which are barely regulated in this regard, so good luck with enforcing it.

In my experience most of these came from France itself or from Italy. Not exactly third world, eh?

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#29

Post by inigyou »

gruez wrote: post #27
inigyou wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are three kinds of VOIP you could be talking about. The first kind sends your call out from a local number in the country you're calling to. So someone in France has a French number, and you can use it following French local tariffs + a bit. The owner of this number would be prosecuted if he didn't cooperate with enforcing the law. The second way is that you use IP to connect to your own country's PSTN. Normal…

At least in the US, VOIP providers (think google voice or twilio) interconnect with telephone companies similar to how landline/cellphone companies interconnect with each other, so #1 and #4 are essentially the same. The only difference is what the "from" number appears as. If you look at the price lists of voip providers, you'll note that the only factor that determines the price is where you're calling to, not wher…

That provider is either only providing service to one country (very likely because this is separately regulated in every country), is showing you prices specific to your country, or is doing #1 and making themselves liable for spam.

Re: France is banning unsolicited telemarketing calls starting next week

#30

Post by yourusername »

erelong wrote: post #25

what does HN think are the better alternatives to cold contact? businesses obviously keep doing unsolicited telemarketing calls because it works to some extent

Does there have to be a alternative? Companies preying on the elderly and uninformed is not something we necessarily need as a society. (99% of my telemarketing calls are scams where they pretend to represent my current power company to get me to sign a contract with a different company).
Post reply on HN