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The Price of Happiness (2024)

happiness-science.org

21–30 of 57 posts

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#21

Money provides freedom, not happiness.

For most people, freedom is the only missing piece holding them back from being happy so that distinction melts away for them.

Freedom is the only missing piece holding them back from pursuing what they think will make them happy. That freedom makes them happy today, happy with the hope of tomorrow's happiness. But a number of people find that pursuing that thing (whatever it is for them) doesn't actually make them happy. Now they're less happy, because not only are they not happy, but their dream of future happiness has also died.

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#22
It is difficult to know when you 'have enough' money because like death, you never know what is around the corner. Most of us earn, save, and spend money during our working lives so that we can retire comfortably; but it seems like there is no magic number for when we have arrived.

How long will we live? What will our health be like? Would we like to travel? Leave the kids an inheritance? Give it away? All of these can influence the number.

The secret to amassing wealth is to always live beneath your means; but don't forget to enjoy yourself as you make the journey towards retirement.

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#23
post #19
post #3

> What is the shape of the relationship between money and happiness, and what are its implications? 1. money != income. 2. Zip codes. 3. Age. 4. Social class. a) 65 year old professor living in Woodside, CA, with a net worth of $250,000K b) 35 year old HVAC business owner living in Fresno, CA, with a net worth of $2,000,000 First is poor, second is rich, but the study conflates both into the same bucket if they both…

> but the study conflates both into the same bucket if they both make, say, $400K/yr Annual income is easy to measure, net worth isn't. People like to measure things that are easier to measure. :P This is part of how 'millionaire' has gone from 'someone who has a million dollars' (for some value of has) to 'someone who has a million dollars of income per year'

I guess annual income also hints at annual expenses which should be important for the study. There are people who constantly spend all they make, and probably score low on self assessed happiness. Also income != wage, can be passive.

I think for a study like this, a money-happiness correlation would need a more sophisticated definition of money, to account for peer pressure and spending.

For a given zip code - take p75 of pre-tax income, multiply by 50% - this would be a proxy of how much someone needs to spend per year to be comfortable with local cost of living and their peers. 50% takes taxes and savings out, call it spend/burn. Then someone's wealth could be a ratio of net-worth/burn. The higher the wealthier - people 25 and over essentially not needing to work, and people with < 3 are essentially in indentured servitude, even with high income. Control for age.

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#25

It is difficult to know when you 'have enough' money because like death, you never know what is around the corner. Most of us earn, save, and spend money during our working lives so that we can retire comfortably; but it seems like there is no magic number for when we have arrived. How long will we live? What will our health be like? Would we like to travel? Leave the kids an inheritance? Give it away? All of these c…

Lots of people enjoy what they do. There's no reason any of the billionares HN complains about couldn't go retire but they don't. Most of them are busy AF. Because they want to be as clearly they have the funds to stop

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#27
As always, correlation is not causation, so it's very possible that the people who tend to be happier also tend to maybe fit into society better and thus get higher paying jobs, not that you necessarily need to make X/year to be happier.

It is still interesting to see how the actual numbers shake out though, especially the section on how the income quintile groups actually scale linearly instead of log linearly with reported happiness.

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#28

This may be a very tone deaf thing to say, but what really helps me is to just tell myself I am happy. It's certainly not fool-proof when faced with genuine problems, but I often find myself unhappy or annoyed for no particular reason. In those moments I just tell myself I have everything I need and life is great, and then it just feels better. That said all the findings that these studies seem to gravitate towards l…

that doesn't feel tone deaf to me, and is a legit strategy to kick-start deeper happiness and satisfaction. I a huge component of money-related unhappiness to me appears to be context, i.e. people who need more.

Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#29

Harvard has been running longitudinal studies for several decades: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grant_Study and their findings lean towards good relationships with family and friends are highly correlation with happiness, health, and many aspects of financial success. The released a book summarizing many results a few years ago: * https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/61273746-the-good-life * https://archive.is/http…

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Re: The Price of Happiness (2024)

#30
post #13

A classic paper worth a read: If money doesn't make you happy, then you probably aren't spending it right by Elizabeth Dunn, Daniel Gilbert, & Timothy D. Wilson https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S10577... Includes explicit recommendations (even in the short abstract)!

Reading the paper I have a repeating puzzlement, wondering if they are trolling or sincere. For example, about the benefits of delaying consumption to happiness: ... For example, when asked to choose a snack from an array that included apples, bananas, paprika-flavored crisps, and Snickers bars, people overwhelmingly selected an unhealthy snack if it was to be consumed immediately, but drifted toward the healthier options when selecting a snack to be consumed the following week (Read & van Leeuwen, 1998). Because the present seems to be viewed under an emotional magnifying glass, people gave in to the temptation of salty, sweet satiation when it was immediately available, but when such satiation receded into the future, this temptation no longer loomed large, freeing people to select more virtuous options—and perhaps to appreciate the abstract health benefits of a banana at least as much as the more concrete deliciousness of nutty, chocolaty nougat. ...

I would say that delaying the pleasure in this case distances the pleasure anticipation from the decision, just like deciding to start going to the gym next week is much easier decision to do then deciding to start right now. Appreciation of the health benefits of next week's banana combined with the lesser, mediocre pleasure that will be felt eating it, might be better for the individual health then having that Savoy truffle right now, but no, the banana will never bring the same pleasure or happiness. Never.

(link to the full version easily found in google: https://dunn.psych.ubc.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/1-s2-0-...)

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