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Japanese symbols that speak without words

arun.is

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Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#21

Post by CHUNK_CHUNK »

One thing I'd add: the "kuuki wo yomu" concept extends beyond symbols into everyday social cues too. A classic example is the "genkan" (entryway) — the slight step-up from outdoor to indoor floor level silently tells you where to remove your shoes, no sign needed. The whole house layout enforces the unspoken rule.

Train station melody chimes are another great example — they differ by station and line, so locals unconsciously recognize which station they're at by sound alone, without reading anything.

There are countless other forms of "reading the air" throughout Japanese daily life. I'd genuinely recommend visiting Japan once to experience it firsthand.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#22

Post by nekooooo »

IndySun wrote: post #17
comradesmith wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand your comment. Can you spell it out for me?

The article is decent, but the headline is saying something demonstrably false - evidenced by the article itself. Not one of the symbols can possibly be understood as to its intended meaning without learning what the symbol represents - that is to say, simply by looking at any of them in no way whatsoever suggests, hints, or shows their meaning in the appropriate context.

japan glazing imho and i love kamon (family crests). you could have written this article about almost any country.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#23

Post by xp84 »

1-6 wrote: post #19

I don't see anything particularly special about these symbols. Don't get me wrong, I like Japan but while these icons look nice, don't most symbols already speak without words?

My reading of it is that it isn't the use of symbols that is notable, but rather here are a few handfuls of roles that symbolic decals and signs have been given in Japan, most of which we don't have in North America at least. A lot of them are quite smart. Sure, the special badge for the front of a police or fire vehicle is pretty redundant, but it would be nice if we had a universal understanding of a couple of these just as we understand what the blue handicap icon means. I would nominate the best as:

1. The cross + heart one for people with hidden disabilities. This is probably top of mind for me because I have a family member who could use some extra understanding due to a condition.

2. The new driver, elderly driver, and deaf driver. The first one is obviously so useful that we've just created dozens of one-off text decals (clearly inferior, as they have to be noticed, read, and interpreted, rather than just recognized). It should be handed to you along with your permit and made compulsory like Japan describes.

As for the elderly one, it would be useful to tip us off to give them more space, and also to inspire us to think of our grandmas when we see such a car making a mistake on the road, instead of defaulting to assuming the driver is a deliberately uncourteous prick as we sometimes do.

(As for the "if people are too old to drive correctly, we should take their licenses away" argument, let's assume it's been made, and that someone has pointed out the tradeoffs of that policy in the real world that we live in.)

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#25

Post by xp84 »

robocat wrote: post #2

The common theme for the discussed symbols is consideration for others. In New Zealand we require a yellow [L] sign on cars with learner drivers (with learners drivers licenses). However I get the impression that other drivers are less considerate around a car displaying the [L] sign. I suspect New Zealanders are generally far less considerate than Japanese. Politeness avoids a trillion sharp edges. We also seem to b…

That's nuts. I have seen a car in my city with a sticker that says:

  NEW DRIVER

  I'm freaking trying!!
It makes me smile every time. I honestly had a hard time when I was first learning, and especially transitioning to driving in an urban environment. I would say those streets, intersections, etc. were poorly designed, but of course, none of it was designed, urban road designs simply "happen" and people need to just improvise their way through it.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#26

Post by xp84 »

lexicality wrote: post #5
netsharc wrote: post #3

The logo expressing "Limited Express" is very unspecific, imagine if buses with the Mercedes star cost extra and didn't stop at every stop. Interesting that a lot of US road signs have words on them: https://ygraph.com/graphs/roadsigns-20120316T030941-ekrruua.... , or are obvious, whereas in Europe drivers need to learn what they mean: https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/img/b/R29vZ2xl/AVvXsEh... For example the yi…

It was very surprising for me when I visited the US to see just how much space was wasted writing everything out on every sign and sometimes in giant words on the road. It did also make me a bit worried about the expected level of driver education...

To me it's odd to imply people must be stupid because they're expected to read a few simple words such as "Left lane must turn left" rather than to memorize a bunch of symbols.

American signs very frequently combine both styles - for instance, you see the above words next to a sign with arrows for whatever lanes, wordlessly illustrating the turn types permitted.

If someone is a new driver, who hasn't seen the symbolic signs enough, the word signs are a good fallback. The goal is to maximize accessibility.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#27

Post by Blikkentrekker »

1-6 wrote: post #19

I don't see anything particularly special about these symbols. Don't get me wrong, I like Japan but while these icons look nice, don't most symbols already speak without words?

There is a general culture that one sometimes sees which treats anything related to Japan as highly remarkable. Ancient Japanese swords can literally cut through diamond like butter by being folded over 1 000 times after all.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#28

Post by freetime2 »

IndySun wrote: post #17
comradesmith wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand your comment. Can you spell it out for me?

The article is decent, but the headline is saying something demonstrably false - evidenced by the article itself. Not one of the symbols can possibly be understood as to its intended meaning without learning what the symbol represents - that is to say, simply by looking at any of them in no way whatsoever suggests, hints, or shows their meaning in the appropriate context.

I understood the article to mean, for example, that the help mark allows people on a train to signal "though I may not outwardly appear like I am disabled, I do have a need for priority seating". And thus people would (hopefully) offer up their seat without needing to be asked with words.

I don't think they meant that the symbols should be universally understood without need for explanation. That would be accomplished separately through some sort of public education campaign. In the case of the "help mark", they actually explain what it means in multiple languages in a big sign right above the priority seating [1].

[1] https://www.kotsu.metro.tokyo.jp/eng/guides/conduct/

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#29

Post by woozlewuzzle »

JimTheMan wrote: post #16
robocat wrote: post #2

The common theme for the discussed symbols is consideration for others. In New Zealand we require a yellow [L] sign on cars with learner drivers (with learners drivers licenses). However I get the impression that other drivers are less considerate around a car displaying the [L] sign. I suspect New Zealanders are generally far less considerate than Japanese. Politeness avoids a trillion sharp edges. We also seem to b…

I didn't find that to the case in Australia, as someone who had L's for far longer than is standard. Mostly it meant that people gave you a wide berth, as learner drivers are unpredictable at times. So basically, what the sign intends. It surprises me to hear that about NZ? As I think of NZ, as our friendlier cousin. Just goes to show that our experiences are always hyperlocalised, and it's hard to actually make gene…

Where abouts where you driving in Australia?

I've had the same experiences as the parent commenter when learning to drive in Sydney. In general drivers in the bigger cities seem to be very aggressive.

Re: Japanese symbols that speak without words

#30

Post by payphonefiend »

ggm wrote: post #15
robocat wrote: post #2

The common theme for the discussed symbols is consideration for others. In New Zealand we require a yellow [L] sign on cars with learner drivers (with learners drivers licenses). However I get the impression that other drivers are less considerate around a car displaying the [L] sign. I suspect New Zealanders are generally far less considerate than Japanese. Politeness avoids a trillion sharp edges. We also seem to b…

Also in the UK and Aus. It's bizarre that a sign saying "I'm learning, be kind" encourages some people to monster you, follow you swearing, generally hassle you. (33 years ago, still in my memory) It's as if they think it means HTFU and then go to hazing.

In Aus when you get on your P plates you instantly feel like a mad dog and aggressively overtake L platers
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