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Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

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Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His second wife also happened to be his first cousin. Interestingly, they shared the "Einstein" surname (their fathers were also first cousins) and would have shared it at the time they married, but Elsa had already married and divorced by that point.

If their fathers were first cousins, wouldn't that make them second cousins?

Not necessarily; their mothers were sisters, and their fathers were cousins on their father's side (so both Albert and Elsa had the surname "Einstein").

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering Einstein didn't kill anyone...he did OK. No one is a saint (except for maybe a saint, but then I've heard crazy things about Mother Teresa also).

Einstein didn't directly kill anyone, but he did sign a letter to President Roosevelt urging him to fund research into nuclear weapons.

I think this is a rational thing to do -- after all, he was fearful of what would happen should the Germans have completed their nuclear program first.

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#23
This makes him sound like a jerk, but man was life tough for couples who stopped getting along back when men did all the income earning and women did all the child care and housework. This actually seems like an OK arrangement when you think about it in that context, they were both holding up their ends of the bargain. It just makes me glad that both men and women are more independent these days.

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#24
post #9

It's hard to reconcile the popular folk hero that is Einstein with a letter like this. I suspect a lot of this may come from us not being in a position to judge people from almost 100 years by the standards of today.

What's to reconcile? You will find character flaws and chronic bad judgement in the most successful/accomplished people–it will just be in some other area than what they're known for. John Calvin had a man burned at the stake. Henry Ford was an anti-semite. 8 of the first 10 US presidents owned slaves. And, no, I don't think it's a matter of shifting standards. Look at Bill Clinton, Martha Stewart, etc.

Perhaps reconcile was the wrong word . . . I was looking at it more from the "here's a perfect person" image that some historical figures seem to have, versus the fact that everyone (no matter how history makes them out), is still just a flawed human like everyone else.

He may have been one of the most brilliant minds in the last 100 years, but apparently he had a love life that was just as messed up as the rest of us =)

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#25
Most of these demands relate in some way to staving off a meaningful emotional connection, keeping things "all-business" etc. There's significant evidence that Einstein had a form of high-functioning autism (likely Asperger's). A signature symptom of Asperger's syndrome is discomfort with emotional intimacy and a lesser capacity for empathy.

I can't say if that's true or not, but if you combine these symptoms with the state of women's' rights at the time, this really isn't surprising at all - and in any case, there are far more explicit examples of sexism from this period.

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#26

I had heard a while ago that Einstein was a womanizer. Looks like he was a demanding jerk as well. Just goes to show that there is usually a huge difference between what we think of historical figures and how they actually were. It's interesting how much we want our heroes to be pure and spotless -- unlike any other humans we encounter.

> Just goes to show that there is usually a huge difference between what we think of historical figures and how they actually were.

It shows that people are complicated and multifaceted. While we have a tendency to either laud or vilify figures (with nothing in between), in reality, historical figures can be both "good" and "bad" in different aspects of their lives... just like the rest of us.

My favorite example of this is Helen Keller[1]. Almost nobody these days knows anything about Helen Keller beyond the age of 18 - they know that learned to communicate despite being deaf and blind, but the nearly 70 years of her life after that are almost buried in history.

Which is a shame, because Helen Keller would have been a notable figure in her own right even if it weren't for her disability[2].

But because she was a member of the official Socialist party, we can't use her story as an inspirational lesson and mention that she held political beliefs that we may or may not agree with. Instead have to make a judgement call as to whether her "good" or her "bad[3]" side is more important to teach, and then forget about the rest.

Worse, this principle is applied in reverse to dehumanize people whom history has classified as villains. The result is that our history is filled with monochromatic caricatures, and we forget that, were we to see the complete picture, our modern-day "villains" may not look so different (for better or for worse!)

[1] I believe Loewen talks about this in his excellent book Lies My Teacher Told Me (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lies_My_Teacher_Told_Me)

[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Keller#Political_activiti...

[2] Naturally, this presumes that you either disagree with socialist politics or think that history lessons should be politically neutral, which is the predominant belief in the USA.

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#28
I see lots of people commenting how Einstein was a jerk, etc. But somehow, I think that list (if it's real) just shows that he wanted order (and control?) in everything he did, which doesn't resonate as bad to me. We have no idea what kind of relationship he had with his wife, so I think it is unfair to judge him like that solely based on that list, more so, because his wife accepted it!

Re: Einstein's list of conditions for staying together with his wife

#30
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's to reconcile? You will find character flaws and chronic bad judgement in the most successful/accomplished people–it will just be in some other area than what they're known for. John Calvin had a man burned at the stake. Henry Ford was an anti-semite. 8 of the first 10 US presidents owned slaves. And, no, I don't think it's a matter of shifting standards. Look at Bill Clinton, Martha Stewart, etc.

Considering Einstein didn't kill anyone...he did OK. No one is a saint (except for maybe a saint, but then I've heard crazy things about Mother Teresa also).

Agnes Bojaxhiu aka mother theresa is one of the worst media scams out there. Portrayed as a saint, she was actually an extremist religious nutjob. I happen to have visited her hospice in Calcutta and was shocked to see its condition given the significant amount of donations being sent. Victims (not patients, they were poor uneducated rural folk being collected for display) were denied painkillers and modern medication because Agnes believed in the theology of suffering. A quick google will show you that Agnes managed to get most of the donations funnelled back to the Vatican, hence her beatification by the pope. I found the whole thing utterly disgusting and will never trust generic media representations of individuals.
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