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50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

fortune.com

21–30 of 164 posts

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#21

This is like the movie Chinatown, where people were fighting over water, but now it's all about electricity. It sounds like Lake Tahoe residents kicked the can down the road and didn't care about electricity for so long that now they have to pay the piper. I think it's entire just that they have to bear the costs of their own electricity.

Eh, not really.

Few years ago everybody was talking about the inadequacies of our aging electricity distribution infrastructure and how it was a shame it wasn't being fixed and the risks it entails.

Now folks are wailing about the terrible AI come for our electricity and how awful the burden of the upgrades are.

When the upgrades were for solar they were good, when upgrades are for AI they're bad. It's almost like people just want to complain about anything associated with something they don't like regardless of relevance.

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#22
post #6
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, power is a public utility. And regulated as such. The providers can be private though and depends a lot on the location. Personally, I wouldn’t trust my city or county to operate a power plant and transmission lines. I’m happy that power is regulated by my state as a natural monopoly.

That is not 100% true though. In Burbank, CA the power is city owned. https://www.burbankwaterandpower.com/

I didn’t say it was 100% true and there are exceptions.

I don’t know the true distribution, but I’d wager the vast majority of the US is served by either a corporation or some non-government organization.

Now I know and it’s 1/7 or about 15% of Americans have government or community owned power. [0]

[0] https://www.publicpower.org/public-power

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#24
post #6
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, power is a public utility. And regulated as such. The providers can be private though and depends a lot on the location. Personally, I wouldn’t trust my city or county to operate a power plant and transmission lines. I’m happy that power is regulated by my state as a natural monopoly.

That is not 100% true though. In Burbank, CA the power is city owned. https://www.burbankwaterandpower.com/

Palo Alto's power is city owned as well. I think we're building out fiber too.

Public infrastructure shouldn't be private. Imagine the nightmare of privately owned roads and highways.

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#25
post #16

Northern Nevada would be such an obvious place to build out large amounts of solar energy as well

There are quite a few already (though not as many as in the southern part): https://cleanview.co/solar-farms/nevada

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#26

This is like the movie Chinatown, where people were fighting over water, but now it's all about electricity. It sounds like Lake Tahoe residents kicked the can down the road and didn't care about electricity for so long that now they have to pay the piper. I think it's entire just that they have to bear the costs of their own electricity.

Eh, not really. Few years ago everybody was talking about the inadequacies of our aging electricity distribution infrastructure and how it was a shame it wasn't being fixed and the risks it entails. Now folks are wailing about the terrible AI come for our electricity and how awful the burden of the upgrades are. When the upgrades were for solar they were good, when upgrades are for AI they're bad. It's almost like pe…

It's almost like people just want to complain about anything associated with something they don't like regardless of relevance.

I've noticed that we don't hear a lot about the EV boogyman taking down our electric grid now that AI has come to town.

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#27
post #5
post #2

Power should be a public utility, just like water and sewage.

In the US, power is a public utility. And regulated as such. The providers can be private though and depends a lot on the location. Personally, I wouldn’t trust my city or county to operate a power plant and transmission lines. I’m happy that power is regulated by my state as a natural monopoly.

Concord, MA, has a municipal power company and a municipal isp. I think they run a power plant, but I know they maintain the transmission lines.

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#28
post #2

Power should be a public utility, just like water and sewage.

You can make a reasonable case for transmission and distribution to be a government operated public utility. But we need aggressive private industry competition on the generation and storage side in order to prevent shortages.

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#29
post #6
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the US, power is a public utility. And regulated as such. The providers can be private though and depends a lot on the location. Personally, I wouldn’t trust my city or county to operate a power plant and transmission lines. I’m happy that power is regulated by my state as a natural monopoly.

That is not 100% true though. In Burbank, CA the power is city owned. https://www.burbankwaterandpower.com/

That there are city owned utilities doesn't seem to refute any of prepend's statement.

> In the US, power is a public utility.

A city owned utility is both a public utiliy because it offers a utility service to the public and a public utility because it is municipally owned.

> And regulated as such.

I expect Burbank W&P is regulated by the CPUC, same as other power utilities that operate in California.

> The providers can be private though and depends a lot on the location.

Many providers are private; this one isn't, and it depends on the location.

> Personally, I wouldn’t trust my city or county to operate a power plant and transmission lines. I’m happy that power is regulated by my state as a natural monopoly.

This is, like prepend's opinion, man. I assume they are truthfully expressing their trust and happiness. Even if they lived within the service area of Burbank W&P or another municipal power utility, they might not trust it.

As to power being a natural monopoly, it's hard to tell exactly given that it exists in a highly regulated market; but I don't know of any US markets where there is a choice for electrical distribution. You get the utility that serves your property, or you get to pay them to build their network to serve your property, or you get no utility power (and in some locations, no certiticate of occupancy). I'm sure there's some exceptions such as a lot that stradles the service areas or a lot with a high availability use that requirea feeds from multiple substations and it makes more sense to wire to a substation from a neighboring utility. And there's the legacy DC power networks in some old cities. But generally, there's no overbuilding of competing distribution lines; unlike say telecom where many areas have at least two of copper telephone, copper coax cable, and fiber telecom; and often several vendors if you're willing to pay commercial rates for cabling.

Re: 50K Tahoe residents need power as utility eyes redirecting lines to data centers

#30
post #12
post #7

It's weird to read an article about how AI is ruining Lake Tahoe, with a map illustrating the problem, when the map itself has the world's most generic "100% generated by Claude" UI ever. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with the article using the Claude map. It's just deeply funny somehow.

"Breaking: Smartphone producers known to rely on slave labor keep doing it. Posted from my iPhone"

That isnt the slam you think it is.

https://truthout.org/art/mister-gotcha/

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