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Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

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Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#21

Post by glenstein »

thunderbong wrote: post #11
irusensei wrote: post #10

I remember trying Opera for the first time in Windows 98 SE. It was one of those versions that prided itself for fitting on a floppy. I think it was 3.0.6 or 3.6. But anyway I was taken by surprise how good it was in comparison to Internet Explorer which at the time was the only browser I ever used.

Vivaldi is it's rightful heir https://vivaldi.com/

I would follow that Vivaldi team to the ends of the Earth, as nobody ever made a better browser in my opinion then they did with those last versions of Opera before they had to sell (versions 11 or 12 I want to say). But for one thing, which is that Vivaldi is unfortunately also a Chromium based browser.

Which means among other things that they didn't have the capacity to sustain manifest v2 while Google pushed the browser into v3. And some version of that will be true when Google starts pushing, say, mandatory sign in, or AI powered DRM enforcement, or hard coded browser level warnings to comply with the law if you visit Anna's Archive, or limit your search engines to "safe" search providers from a list provided by Google, or using your location to determine if you're in a jurisdiction that has banned certain xxx sites.

Love the team, but the world isn't fair. They are the example I keep coming back to whenever I hear people say "Mozilla should focus on the browser!" (as if they don't). Opera is your perfect natural experiment in demonstrating that success is driven much more by distribution monopolies. If focusing on the browser and delivering best in class performance and focusing on core features your users most wanted were the things that delivered market share we would all be using Opera right now and they never would have had to sell.

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#22

Post by mrweasel »

freehorse wrote: post #12
irusensei wrote: post #10

I remember trying Opera for the first time in Windows 98 SE. It was one of those versions that prided itself for fitting on a floppy. I think it was 3.0.6 or 3.6. But anyway I was taken by surprise how good it was in comparison to Internet Explorer which at the time was the only browser I ever used.

Everything else after opera dropped Presto and became a chrome clone felt like a downgrade to me. I never got the same feeling of easy of use and control over a browser. I kept using the 12.16 for as much as I could, then switched to firefox. The new "opera browser" now is a different browser just sharing the same name. And the beloved opera mini for the mobile was amazing. Back then I would even use it in a vm on my…

When Opera became just another Chromium skin I switch to Firefox. The point for me was Presto, that Opera was really well put together in terms of UI was just a bonus. The developer tools in Opera was better than what shipped in Chrome and Firefox, so switching definitely felt like a downgrade.

Someone, I don't know who, but I assume the new Opera, is still keeping the Opera Mini proxy servers running. It show up in our logs frequently enough that we noticed and have special whitelisting for them to byparse some rate limiting.

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#23

Post by PurpleRamen »

la_oveja wrote: post #2

is there anything else to it than the cassette 3d thing?

Yes, after hitting and/or holding spacebar, something happens, or you change to a new year. Sometimes it's just pictures with some text of whatever was important at that year, sometimes it's animations, sometimes stuff you can interact(?) with. In 1995, there is an old Desktop-PC with Windows 95 booting and starting a modem-connection, and you can type on the keyboard. Pretty pointless, but kinda neat.

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#24

Post by stavros »

freehorse wrote: post #12
irusensei wrote: post #10

I remember trying Opera for the first time in Windows 98 SE. It was one of those versions that prided itself for fitting on a floppy. I think it was 3.0.6 or 3.6. But anyway I was taken by surprise how good it was in comparison to Internet Explorer which at the time was the only browser I ever used.

Everything else after opera dropped Presto and became a chrome clone felt like a downgrade to me. I never got the same feeling of easy of use and control over a browser. I kept using the 12.16 for as much as I could, then switched to firefox. The new "opera browser" now is a different browser just sharing the same name. And the beloved opera mini for the mobile was amazing. Back then I would even use it in a vm on my…

Vivaldi feels like Opera did (makes sense, since it's the same CTO).

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#25

Post by stavros »

glenstein wrote: post #21
thunderbong wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vivaldi is it's rightful heir https://vivaldi.com/

I would follow that Vivaldi team to the ends of the Earth, as nobody ever made a better browser in my opinion then they did with those last versions of Opera before they had to sell (versions 11 or 12 I want to say). But for one thing, which is that Vivaldi is unfortunately also a Chromium based browser. Which means among other things that they didn't have the capacity to sustain manifest v2 while Google pushed the b…

Unfortunately, Google very successfully suffocated innovation on the web by throwing billions at it.

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#27

Post by ramon156 »

netsharc wrote: post #5

Feels as soulless as the Opera that's been bought by a Chinese company to sell predatory lending: https://qz.com/africa/1788351/operas-okash-opesas-predatory-...

It hurts me that their marketing worked. Gamers are Choosing Opera GX because its "non bs". There's a ton of fingerprinting data being sent to chinese servers. No one is immune to propaganda

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#29

Post by glenstein »

stavros wrote: post #25
glenstein wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would follow that Vivaldi team to the ends of the Earth, as nobody ever made a better browser in my opinion then they did with those last versions of Opera before they had to sell (versions 11 or 12 I want to say). But for one thing, which is that Vivaldi is unfortunately also a Chromium based browser. Which means among other things that they didn't have the capacity to sustain manifest v2 while Google pushed the b…

Unfortunately, Google very successfully suffocated innovation on the web by throwing billions at it.

Embrace, Extend, Extinguish.

Re: Opera: Rewind The Web to 1996 (Opera at 30)

#30

Post by freehorse »

stavros wrote: post #24
freehorse wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everything else after opera dropped Presto and became a chrome clone felt like a downgrade to me. I never got the same feeling of easy of use and control over a browser. I kept using the 12.16 for as much as I could, then switched to firefox. The new "opera browser" now is a different browser just sharing the same name. And the beloved opera mini for the mobile was amazing. Back then I would even use it in a vm on my…

Vivaldi feels like Opera did (makes sense, since it's the same CTO).

I bet it is a great browser, but I did not get the same feel as the old opera at the time when I tried, too many features missing back then.

Moreover, not using chromium-based browsers is a kind of matter of principle for me. Chromium has been a monopoly for very long, which gives google too much power on how people may experience the web. This was made especially apparent with the manifest 2 -> 3 transition, but it should have been seen as a concern imo since a good while back.

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