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Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

phys.org

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Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#21

Post by fusslo »

ceejayoz wrote: post #11
fusslo wrote: post #9

I wonder how they prevent contamination of the containers used to collect and store samples. I assume they have to be ultra clean in every sense of the word 'clean' with the cavity pulled to a vacuum. And also the equipment that collects the sample and puts it into the canister has to be clean as well. The logistics aren't obvious to me at all

They seem pretty confident. There's been some conflicting reporting on contamination of the Ryugu samples over time. https://phys.org/news/2024-11-ryugu-asteroid-sample-rapidly-... > Researchers from Imperial College London have discovered that a space-returned sample from asteroid Ryugu was rapidly colonized by terrestrial microorganisms, even under stringent contamination control measures. https://www.isas.jaxa.jp/…

ty ty! I usually just give a quick chatgpt buy my work blocked every ai but copilot

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#22

Post by pixl97 »

0x000xca0xfe wrote: post #15
starburst wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the competition might be too fierce for any new life to develop

We could artificially create a sterile, large pool of the ingredients and see what happens. I've read about experiments like this but only at lab beaker scale.

The bigger the pool the harder to create it here on Earth without introducing problems. For example, take a prion. Hard as hell to actually get rid of, how do you know you've not actually introduced something like this to your sterile pool that's going to make it do things you don't expect.

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#23

Post by pixl97 »

pfdietz wrote: post #16
ceejayoz wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finding short words in strings of random letters at least establishes the existence of letters and words. It doesn't demonstrate the existence of Shakespeare's works, but it's a building block that's good to know exists.

All it means is you can say "if life is rare, it's not because these specific small chemicals can't be produced". Which is a rather weak thing to say. It doesn't imply life isn't rare, or that further advancement the existence of these small building blocks is easy or inevitable.

Finding strong things here is going to be difficult. Sometimes you have to take a bunch of weak things to figure out where they lie for guidance.

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#24

Post by HarHarVeryFunny »

0x000xca0xfe wrote: post #15
starburst wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the competition might be too fierce for any new life to develop

We could artificially create a sterile, large pool of the ingredients and see what happens. I've read about experiments like this but only at lab beaker scale.

Yeah, but it seems impossible to experiment on the scale that would have happened in nature where there would have been millions of localized "test tube experiments" ongoing for millions of years.

Of course people can, and do, try to replicate early earth environments and self-assembling proto-cells, but I'm not sure how intellectually satisfying any self-replication success from these "designer experiments" would be, unless perhaps done on such a large scale (simulation vs test tube?) that any conclusions could be made about what likely happened in nature - just how specific do the conditions need to be?

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#25

Post by _joel »

0x000xca0xfe wrote: post #8

One longstanding theory is that life first began on Earth when asteroids carrying fundamental elements crashed into our planet long ago. I'm no expert but this sounds strange. Surely those fundamental elements would also form in vast quantities on their own on an entire planet with volcanoes and oceans? Wouldn't a couple asteroids be the literal drop in the ocean in comparison? The missing part is how do they form se…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Late_Heavy_Bombardment - possibly?

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#27

Post by johnsmalles »

Fascinating that all five nucleobases were found in Ryugu samples. The fact that these formed abiotically in an asteroid environment strengthens the case that the building blocks of life are common throughout the solar system. The amino acid findings from the same samples were already compelling, but having the complete nucleobase set is a different level of evidence.

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#28

Post by ToucanLoucan »

0x000xca0xfe wrote: post #8

One longstanding theory is that life first began on Earth when asteroids carrying fundamental elements crashed into our planet long ago. I'm no expert but this sounds strange. Surely those fundamental elements would also form in vast quantities on their own on an entire planet with volcanoes and oceans? Wouldn't a couple asteroids be the literal drop in the ocean in comparison? The missing part is how do they form se…

Admittedly, am layman, have only heard numerous sciencey folks talk about it, but we've found all these basic components in space already, naturally occurring, and while we've never to my knowledge recreated actual, genuine abiogenesis, we have observed every process required for abiogenesis to be a reasonable explanation for the origin of life.

As to your question on we should see the formation of new life everywhere, well, if we looked hard enough we might? The answer is competitive exclusion. Abiogenesis would've occurred on a remarkably clean earth: any life now emerging from the proverbial space dust is both almost certainly not preconfigured for this biosphere, and is instantly drowning in competing microorganisms that are. Anything that does form is likely quickly killed either by natural forces or competing organisms. Meanwhile, our life goes everywhere: We've found living bacteria on the outside of the ISS!

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#29

Post by HarHarVeryFunny »

0x000xca0xfe wrote: post #15
starburst wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the competition might be too fierce for any new life to develop

We could artificially create a sterile, large pool of the ingredients and see what happens. I've read about experiments like this but only at lab beaker scale.

I don't think you'd want a single homogeneous "large pool", but rather a large variety of different types of micro-environment, including all those that have been suggested as possible environments for the emergence of life - the chemical and physical environments of hydrothermal vents, volcanic hot springs, shorelines, different types of rocks, clays, etc. You'd want to have environments that included all energy sources present on earth (solar, lightening, geothermal), all forms of mechanical agitation/mixing (hydrothermal, waves), etc, etc.

Re: Ryugu asteroid samples contain all DNA and RNA building blocks

#30

Post by 0x000xca0xfe »

HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #24
0x000xca0xfe wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We could artificially create a sterile, large pool of the ingredients and see what happens. I've read about experiments like this but only at lab beaker scale.

Yeah, but it seems impossible to experiment on the scale that would have happened in nature where there would have been millions of localized "test tube experiments" ongoing for millions of years. Of course people can, and do, try to replicate early earth environments and self-assembling proto-cells, but I'm not sure how intellectually satisfying any self-replication success from these "designer experiments" would be…

My personal theory is that the conditions for life are plentiful in the universe but it probably took an unbelieavable number of random chemical/mechanical events to form the first proto-lifeform.

    The discovery comes after these building blocks of life were detected on another asteroid called Bennu, suggesting they are abundant throughout the solar system.
Yet actual life remains to be discovered...
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