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North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

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Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#21

Post by TacticalCoder »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #3

Yes they were, but the key difference is that North Korea is not actually a threat and its nuclear weapons program is obviously purely a deterrent. The track record of Iran is very different. Even if nuclear weapons were only a deterrent they would likely embolden them to be more aggressive abroad.

> The track record of Iran is very different

Just so that people disagreeing with you can understand: Iran is, as I type this, sending bombs banned by 120 countries (cluster bombs, and they're banned because for they indiscriminately target civilians) on Israel. They also send their islamist guards, a few weeks ago, to finish the job inside hospitals: to slaughter the wounded. As part of tens of thousands executions.

Anyone who thinks the current iranian regime with the atomic bomb wouldn't nuke Israel is out of its mind.

Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#23

Post by jfengel »

fakedang wrote: post #17
infotainment wrote: post #12

This article misses a major point: even without nuclear weapons, NK has always had the option to shell Seoul with conventional artillery and completely destroy it. That, above all else, is likely why no one tried to topple them before they were able to develop nuclear weapons.

The point of nukes for NK is not about being able to use them to attack its neighbours. The point of nukes for NK is to ensure that they don't get invaded themselves. That's why NK makes a big deal about nukes that can reach the US - currently the only viable threat the NK regime has had is the US. Which is also the reason why Pakistan pursued a nuclear programme (vs India). Which is why India pursued a nuclear progr…

The US doesn't want to invade North Korea. North Korea is a Chinese ally. China doesn't want the US on its border. North Korea doesn't need its own nukes to keep the US out.

At least, that was true. Here in 2026, nobody can say what the US will do with its military. Its goals are opaque and its actions often self-defeating.

Even so, if the US invades North Korea, NK's nukes won't be the most important thing. It would instantly become a US/China conflict with much, much, much larger stakes.

Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#24

Post by fakedang »

jfengel wrote: post #23
fakedang wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point of nukes for NK is not about being able to use them to attack its neighbours. The point of nukes for NK is to ensure that they don't get invaded themselves. That's why NK makes a big deal about nukes that can reach the US - currently the only viable threat the NK regime has had is the US. Which is also the reason why Pakistan pursued a nuclear programme (vs India). Which is why India pursued a nuclear progr…

The US doesn't want to invade North Korea. North Korea is a Chinese ally. China doesn't want the US on its border. North Korea doesn't need its own nukes to keep the US out. At least, that was true. Here in 2026, nobody can say what the US will do with its military. Its goals are opaque and its actions often self-defeating. Even so, if the US invades North Korea, NK's nukes won't be the most important thing. It would…

But the fact of the matter is, in the event the US does invade North Korea, Rocketman has the option to launch nukes at the US - something that the US knows, hence it won't do anything about. Nukes also give NK more optionality, instead of being a territorial buffer state for the Chinese.

Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#25

Post by aeonik »

cucumber3732842 wrote: post #9
aeonik wrote: post #7

North Korea is protected and bordered by China. Big difference with Iran.

Only slightly more than Cuba is "protected" by the United states. It's more of a "don't F around in my back yard" statement directed at anyone who might than it is a protection deal.

I am not sure what your point is?

My point is the US at one point had taken the entire Korean Peninsula, and was pushed out by an initial push of hundreds of thousands, then over a million Chinese troops.

The reason tht US hasn't invaded North Korea since is because China won't allow it.

Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#26

Post by reliabilityguy »

credit_guy wrote: post #16

What this type of analysis is missing is that it is extraordinarily hard to build the bomb. North Korea could get the bomb because they had qualms about letting hundreds of thousands or millions of people literally starve to death [1]. But let's say another country, country X, wants to acquire the bomb now. Then what? First thing: the IAEA inspectors discover that. Building a bomb is too massive an operation to be do…

North Korea had not oil income like Iran did.

That being said sanctions did made Iran poor. So, it is not clear from the point of view of a regular Iranian if it was worth it.

Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#27

Post by reliabilityguy »

gherkinnn wrote: post #6
mytailorisrich wrote: post #3

Yes they were, but the key difference is that North Korea is not actually a threat and its nuclear weapons program is obviously purely a deterrent. The track record of Iran is very different. Even if nuclear weapons were only a deterrent they would likely embolden them to be more aggressive abroad.

In practice, Iran posed a local threat. It wasn't Iran that exported Wahabism around the globe. Iran didn't fund the Mujahedeen, nor was it the source of IS. It wasn't Persians flying the jets of 911 nor were any Iranians or their allies tied to any terrorist attacks in Europe in my lifetime. I find the Iranian regime despicable, as frankly any decent human should, and I am glad they don't have nukes. But I do not se…

> But I do not see them as the international turbo villains they've been painted as.

Iran founded Hizbalah in Lebanon. You can read what Hizb had done to Lebanon on the internet. Iran exported its ideology all over the Middle East right now: Yemen, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, etc. It is a mistake to thing about Islamic Revolution as something not interested in spreading itself.

Re: North Korea Was Right About Nuclear Weapons

#28

Post by nephihaha »

beeflet wrote: post #2

This is my analogy: If you are a fisherman, and you try to catch big beautiful fish and release small ugly fish back into the water, then eventually the pond will be full of small ugly fish because that is what you are selecting for. If we want a world in which nuclear weapons are not the primary tools of war (which advantages these smaller players like NK that use it defensively when their means of conventional warf…

There is no presumably about Israel. It is armed with nukes. It gives every indication of being so. Mordecai Vanunu was persecuted for leaking info.
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