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Automatic Programming

antirez.com

21–30 of 257 posts

Re: Automatic Programming

#21
I have 30+ years of industry experience and I've been leaning heavily into spec driven development at work and it is a game changer. I love programming and now I get to program at one level higher: the spec.

I spend hours on a spec, working with Claude Code to first generate and iterate on all the requirements, going over the requirements using self-reviews in Claude first using Opus 4.5 and then CoPilot using GPT-5.2. The self-reviews are prompts to review the spec using all the roles and perspectives it thinks are appropriate. This self review process is critical and really polishes the requirements (I normally run 7-8 rounds of self-review).

Once the requirements are polished and any questions answered by stakeholders I use Claude Code again to create a extremely detailed and phased implementation plan with full code, again all in the spec (using a new file is the requirements doc is so large is fills the context window). The implementation plan then goes though the same multi-round self review using two models to polish (again, 7 or 8 rounds), finalized with a review by me.

The result? I can then tell Claude Code to implement the plan and it is usually done in 20 minutes. I've delivered major features using this process with zero changes in acceptance testing.

What is funny is that everything old is new again. When I started in industry I worked in defense contracting, working on the project to build the "black box" for the F-22. When I joined the team they were already a year into the spec writing process with zero code produced and they had (iirc) another year on the schedule for the spec. At my third job I found a literal shelf containing multiple binders that laid out the spec for a mainframe hosted publishing application written in the 1970s.

Looking back I've come to realize the agile movement, which was a backlash against this kind of heavy waterfall process I experienced at the start of my career, was basically an attempt to "vibe code" the overall system design. At least for me AI assisted mini-waterfall ("augmented cascade"?) seems a path back to producing better quality software that doesn't suffer from the agile "oh, I didn't think of that".

Re: Automatic Programming

#22

I stopped reading at "soon to become the practice of writing software". That belief has no basis at this point and it's been demonstrated not only that AI doesn't improve coding but also that the costs associated are not sustainable.

I continued reading, but you're right. Why did the author feel that it was necessary to include that?

Re: Automatic Programming

#23
"I automatically programmed it" doesn't really roll off the tongue, nor does it make much sense - I reckon we need a better term.

It certainly quicker (and at times, more fun!) to develop this way, that is for certain.

Re: Automatic Programming

#24
post #18

> Pre-training is, actually, our collective gift I feel like this wording isn't great when there are many impactful open source programmers who have explicitly stated that they don't want their code used to train these models and licensed their work in a world where LLMs didn't exist. It wasn't their "gift", it was unwillingly taken from them. > I'm a programmer, and I use automatic programming. The code I generate i…

I don't think it's possible to separate any open source contribution from the ones that came before it, as we're all standing on the shoulders of giants. Every developer learns from their predecessors and adapts patterns and code from existing projects.

Re: Automatic Programming

#25
post #18

> Pre-training is, actually, our collective gift I feel like this wording isn't great when there are many impactful open source programmers who have explicitly stated that they don't want their code used to train these models and licensed their work in a world where LLMs didn't exist. It wasn't their "gift", it was unwillingly taken from them. > I'm a programmer, and I use automatic programming. The code I generate i…

> I feel like this wording isn't great when there are many impactful open source programmers who have explicitly stated that they don't want their code used to train these models

That’s been the fate of many creators since the dawn of time. Kafka explicitly stated that he wanted his works to be burned after his death. So when you’re reading about Gregor’s awkward interactions with his sister, you’re literally consuming the private thoughts of a stranger who stated plainly that he didn’t want them shared with anyone.

Yet people still talk about Kafka’s “contribution to literature” as if it were otherwise, with most never even bothering to ask themselves whether they should be reading that stuff at all.

Re: Automatic Programming

#26
post #23

"I automatically programmed it" doesn't really roll off the tongue, nor does it make much sense - I reckon we need a better term. It certainly quicker (and at times, more fun!) to develop this way, that is for certain.

You will say I programmed it, there is no longer for this distinction. But then you can add that you used automatic programming in the process. But shortly there will be no need to refer to this term similarly to how today you don't specify you used an editor...

Re: Automatic Programming

#28
post #18

> Pre-training is, actually, our collective gift I feel like this wording isn't great when there are many impactful open source programmers who have explicitly stated that they don't want their code used to train these models and licensed their work in a world where LLMs didn't exist. It wasn't their "gift", it was unwillingly taken from them. > I'm a programmer, and I use automatic programming. The code I generate i…

when you inplement a quick sort, do you credit Hoare in the comments?

Re: Automatic Programming

#29
post #24
post #18

> Pre-training is, actually, our collective gift I feel like this wording isn't great when there are many impactful open source programmers who have explicitly stated that they don't want their code used to train these models and licensed their work in a world where LLMs didn't exist. It wasn't their "gift", it was unwillingly taken from them. > I'm a programmer, and I use automatic programming. The code I generate i…

I don't think it's possible to separate any open source contribution from the ones that came before it, as we're all standing on the shoulders of giants. Every developer learns from their predecessors and adapts patterns and code from existing projects.

If you fork an open source project and nuke the git history, that's considered to be a "dick move" because you are erasing the record of people's contributions.

LLMs are doing this on an industrial scale.

Re: Automatic Programming

#30
@antirez if you reading this, it would be insigthful I think if you could share what is your current AI workflow, the tools you use, etc. Thanks!
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