The guide to real-world EV battery health • Hacker News Board

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#21

Post by hdgvhicv » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:43 PM UTC

cogman10 wrote: post #7

Etheryte wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While buying an EV is a greener choice than buying an ICE, a better option still is to use the vehicle you already have for as long as reasonable. This also overlooks the fact that EVs are prohibitively expensive for the vast majority of the population. It isn't the case that people aren't buying them because of preference. Nearly everyone would buy a car that's cheaper to run and maintain if they could afford it.

Bike > walk == public transit > used EV > new EV > used ICE > new ICE That's pretty much the order of "greenness" in personal transport. New EVs will pay off their added carbon footprint in roughly 1 or 2 years in most locations. The ultimate determining factor of how fast that is the energy mix of your local power generation. The only time it'd probably be better to continue using an ICE is if that ICE is a moped or…

My small car does 3,000 miles a year, or 300 litres of petrol a year, or about 1 ton of co2 a year.

How many co2 tons are generated in making a new Nissan leaf?

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#22

Post by cogman10 » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:46 PM UTC

closewith wrote: post #11

cogman10 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bike > walk == public transit > used EV > new EV > used ICE > new ICE That's pretty much the order of "greenness" in personal transport. New EVs will pay off their added carbon footprint in roughly 1 or 2 years in most locations. The ultimate determining factor of how fast that is the energy mix of your local power generation. The only time it'd probably be better to continue using an ICE is if that ICE is a moped or…

Those must be US estimates involving huge mileage, because - taking your existing ICE car's production emissions as an already sunk cost - replacing an existing ICE with a new EV would over a decade of driving the average EU mileage (~10k km) before reaching emissions parity. It takes 2-4 years of that mileage alone for a new EV to reach lifetime emissions parity with a new ICE in the EU (which I know is longer than…

People keep their cars for longer than 2 to 4 years and an EV sold in 2 to 4 years will likely be driven by someone else.

Which is why I put a used EV as being better for the environment vs a new one.

But both will be better for the environment in their lifetime than keeping a used ICE on the road.

It's more economical to keep your current car until it starts seeing major mechanical issues. However, environmentally an EV will (almost) always beat an ICE, the sooner you get one the better. Especially in a place like the EU where you can get even more environmentally friendly EVs due to the lower amounts of driving. You can, for example, grab the BYD seagull which has a 30kWh battery pack. That alone significantly reduces the new EV environmental impact beyond what some of the older numbers would have shown.

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#23

Post by zdragnar » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:47 PM UTC

boplicity wrote: post #18

nritchie wrote: post #9

Hopefully, in coming years, we will see more practically designed EVs that are more affordable. A practical car doesn't need neck-snapping acceleration, every bell-and-whistle and room for a family of six with a dog. I'd like to believe that as batteries cost drop, the incentive to justify the extra cost will drop. Then we can get back to "just basic transportation" rather than a luxury product for the rich. While $3…

Affordable EVs exist and are widely available in some countries. They're effectively banned in North America, though.

This has always been true of gas vehicles as well. They're banned for not having some safety feature or otherwise complying with FMVSS or some other regularity body, not because they are "affordable".

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#24

Post by magicalhippo » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:49 PM UTC

oklahomasports wrote: post #20

81% of original capacity for many cars means when driving at highway speeds you will get like 250 miles or less range per charge. Still dramatically less than gas cars.

Sure but it's also more than enough for what many use their car for. Especially if you can charge at home.

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#25

Post by thinkcontext » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:50 PM UTC

jeffbee wrote: post #12

epistasis wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's absolutely untrue. The majority of the environmental damage is from the ongoing use of it, not from production. Every time you fill up on 20 gallons of gas, that is 400 pounds of CO2 that will be dumped into the air. Used EVs are apparently very cheap. Most new cars are prohibitively expensive, the average new car cost is something like $50k now in the US. If anybody is concerned about cost of new cars, they a…

It is true though, in some cases. The embodied carbon of a Rivian for example is never paid back by operations. So you do have to exercise good judgement in which EV you choose. The category doesn't always win. In my case I already own a hybrid that I only drive 2000 mi/yr and there is not yet an EV that I could buy with so little embodied carbon that it would make sense to do so. At the rate China is decarbonizing,…

> The embodied carbon of a Rivian for example is never paid back by operations

Really? I could imagine it being significantly longer than an average EV, but never? Regardless of driving pattern? Got a link or can you show your math?

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#26

Post by cosmic_cheese » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:50 PM UTC

closewith wrote: post #11

cogman10 wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bike > walk == public transit > used EV > new EV > used ICE > new ICE That's pretty much the order of "greenness" in personal transport. New EVs will pay off their added carbon footprint in roughly 1 or 2 years in most locations. The ultimate determining factor of how fast that is the energy mix of your local power generation. The only time it'd probably be better to continue using an ICE is if that ICE is a moped or…

Those must be US estimates involving huge mileage, because - taking your existing ICE car's production emissions as an already sunk cost - replacing an existing ICE with a new EV would over a decade of driving the average EU mileage (~10k km) before reaching emissions parity. It takes 2-4 years of that mileage alone for a new EV to reach lifetime emissions parity with a new ICE in the EU (which I know is longer than…

Surely the composition of one’s local power grid factors in? There are areas where the share of renewables is much higher than the average.

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#27

Post by conception » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:50 PM UTC

oklahomasports wrote: post #20

81% of original capacity for many cars means when driving at highway speeds you will get like 250 miles or less range per charge. Still dramatically less than gas cars.

While true, an important factor that I didn’t realize until I had one is if you charge at home you wake up with a full tank of”of gas” every day. So yes, you have to stop for a charge on exceptional trips but every other day you aren’t late for work because you need gas or have to stop on the way home. And it’s not just the time to pump, but to get to the station and wait perhaps (costco gas). Your car always “has gas” and all that time is returned to your life.

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#28

Post by snakeboy » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:51 PM UTC

zdragnar wrote: post #23

boplicity wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Affordable EVs exist and are widely available in some countries. They're effectively banned in North America, though.

This has always been true of gas vehicles as well. They're banned for not having some safety feature or otherwise complying with FMVSS or some other regularity body, not because they are "affordable".

I think it's more likely that Chinese EVs are banned in the US because they would absolutely obliterate the domestic car manufacturing industry.

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#29

Post by apinstein » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:52 PM UTC

oklahomasports wrote: post #20

81% of original capacity for many cars means when driving at highway speeds you will get like 250 miles or less range per charge. Still dramatically less than gas cars.

While true, this either matters for you or it doesn’t. Classic Innovator’s Dilemma.

My EV gets only 230mi range at max, and I only charge to 85% which is like 190mi. But I do it at home and never have any range anxiety.

The trajectories for battery improvements indicate it is just a matter of time before those with larger range needs are addressed satisfactorily.

If you cannot slow charge at home or work, it’s a tough story, EV’s aren’t right for you yet, and that’s ok. Roll out of slow charging is less clear that it will be solved in a scaled way. I am not one that believes that 5-10m EV charging is a good goal, it’s very high power and likely not a good price trade off for the time saved. Current 20-30m will likely be the broad solution for those that want EV and cannot charge at home, though I think that’s not a very good solution.

Re: The guide to real-world EV battery health

#30

Post by graemep » Sun, Jan 18, 2026, 2:53 PM UTC

zdragnar wrote: post #23

boplicity wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Affordable EVs exist and are widely available in some countries. They're effectively banned in North America, though.

This has always been true of gas vehicles as well. They're banned for not having some safety feature or otherwise complying with FMVSS or some other regularity body, not because they are "affordable".

That is insane. Smaller vehicles are safer at a social level because they do less damage when they hit something - especially a pedestrian. Regulatory bodies should be encouraging them for that reason alone (let alone all the others).