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Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

dogdogfish.com

21–30 of 111 posts

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#21

It would be a fun exercise to replace social media with alcohol in this article so that it argues we shouldn't ban children from drinking because drinking is bad for adults too.

In most of Europe it's legal for Children to drink alcohol.

You should try to go to "most of Europe" and try to get alcohol as someone <16 and see how that goes.

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#22
post #9

It seems like the things we ban for children are things that we might ban for everybody, but can get away with for children. Very few of those things are conclusively proven to be harmful -- perhaps firearms, motor vehicles, and smoking, and even those things put up a pretty good fight to stay alive as long as they did. Smoking is an interesting case. Vanishingly few people who smoke learned to do so as adults. Virtu…

It's a shame the age-scaled tobacco ban (I think it was proposed in the UK) never went though. You just start raising the legal age for tobacco by one year, every year. Eventually, nobody alive will still be a smoker and you can ban it outright without having taken it away from anyone.

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#23
Banning social media will never work, just as banning prostitution, drugs cigarettes and gambling don't work (in a broad scale). What we can do is change the public (and our) perception of it. Understanding you have a problem is always the first step in any N-step program for whatever addictive substance. Most adults don't see their own consumption and behaviour around social media as harmful or problematic or simply deny they have a problem - just as is the case with any other substance. That is where we have to start. Once we (as in we as society) start agreeing that social media on average (!) is harmful, the narrative shifts. Right now parents don't think they do anything wrong by giving a 10year old a smartphone unsupervised. Everybody in society would look condascending on the parents if they hand out cigarettes to a 10yo child - probably even calling the cops. THAT is the sentiment in society where we need to be. It starts with us adults condemning social media use first, else all attempts to outlaw or ban it will fail.

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#24
post #12

It would be a fun exercise to replace social media with alcohol in this article so that it argues we shouldn't ban children from drinking because drinking is bad for adults too.

We shouldn't ban children from drinking. It doesn't even help, because kids drink anyway, just illegally and largely unsupervised by adults. I certainly drank like a fish when I was underage.

It does help actually. Since it’s banned it’s not socially acceptable . And that makes it sort of regulated

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#25

It would be a fun exercise to replace social media with alcohol in this article so that it argues we shouldn't ban children from drinking because drinking is bad for adults too.

In most of Europe it's legal for Children to drink alcohol.

But they can't legally purchase/access it without the involvement of an adult, unlike social media. You could argue that the parents sanction social media use by giving their kids a phone/computer without any sort of parental controls, but most parents probably have neither the resources nor proper knowledge of how to sufficiently provide a safe platform for their children.

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#26
>Frankly, social media is just too ingrained into the social fabric, and is just too useful and addictive to be banned. So if you have to do something and you can’t meaningfully do anything else…I guess it’s a ban for children.

this is something I've been dwelling on for the past couple days. I've avoided social media my entire adult life, and I'm realizing its akin to not having a car in a suburban sprawl, I can't interact properly with a lot of the modern internet, because of it.

Of course there are advantages, which I don't think i need to state in this community...

But i feel this is something people overlook when discussing banning social media for children. There is a balance to be struck, like anything.

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#28
>In both of these cases (and in others), the harms are there for children and adults, but it’s only children who get banned.

>I don’t use TikTok and it’s no skin off of my back if it gets banned. Banned or not, though, I don’t see a reason to ban it only for children. It doesn’t seem to be more harmful for them. They don’t seem to be using it lots more than adults.

>If you’re going to ban TikTok because it’s harmful or for geopolitical reasons, fine. But ban it universally; if we’re not willing to do that, stop pretending that a child-only ban is principled. A child-only ban is what you do when you want to do something but can’t think of anything better to do, and you don’t want to impact voters.

There are now enough statistics to prove that social media has a negative impact on the mental health of users, especially children and adolescents. Even Meta has kept a study on this topic under wraps. What OP is doing here is putting adults and children on the same level and saying that what applies to children must also apply to adults. The difference, however, is that we as adults have a responsibility toward children. Children enjoy special protection in society and, for good reason, are subject to limited criminal liability. We do this because we assume that children belong to a vulnerable and easily influenced group, and lack the mental and moral maturity to adequately assess their actions. We assume that adults have the necessary mental and moral maturity to adequately assess the consequences of their own actions, which is why they are granted more rights but also more responsibilities than children. OP does not reveal any contradiction or other ‘gotcha’ moment here, unless he generally takes issue with the relationship of responsibility between adults and adolescents.

Re: Banning Things for Other People Is Easy

#29
post #11
post #8

>It’s like studying the social impact of vaping without considering the replacement activity (smoking). That's not how this works. If you ban vaping, not everyone - and not necessarily most people who vape - would be smoking instead. "X isn't as bad as Y" is not a good argument in favor of X. They can both be bad.

Aaaacckkkktuuaally, at my kids school vaping is now an epidemic of sorts. It's much cheaper, it's cool, you get it easily via Snapchat. Many kids later pick up smoking (anecdotally).

I don't think this detracts from OP's point.
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