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Age verification doesn’t work

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Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#21

Post by jakobnissen »

ckbkr10 wrote: post #8

I wish there was a honest discussion, I am with them about parents not giving a shit and pushing away responsibility. The idea of supervision in education institutions is good as well. The kids in my family were well protected and supervised, they got into contact with hardcore porn at the age of 6 when other kids had access to smartphones and exposed them to it. I would like to see a honest discussion about the impa…

But kids (and adults) are exposed to all kinds of fantasies. War is not like Call of Duty. The Mafia is not like GTA. Monarchy is not like in the fairy tales. Romance is not like Twilight. BDSM is not like 50 Shades of Grey.

For all these things, we rely on people's world experience and common sense to figure it out. I think it's pretty obvious that sex is not like porn, and I don't understand why so many people are convinced that people can't tell the difference between fantasy and reality in this domain specifically.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#22

Post by Meneth »

delusional wrote: post #19
decimalenough wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, because law-abiding companies can't offer tools to circumvent the law. As the article says, all this means is that law-abiding porn sites (that, for example, respond to requests to delete CSAM and revenge porn) will go bankrupt and everybody will be driven to sketchypron.xxx instead.

> law-abiding porn sites will go bankrupt How would that work? Can PornHub not exist without the "lucrative" market of children watching porn?

More like, they can't exist without the lucrative market of the 90% of current customers who will refuse age verification and go elsewhere.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#23

Post by nomilk »

delusional wrote: post #15
nomilk wrote: post #6

The choice citizens have now is between an 'internet licence' (submit ID's to myriad sites), or an 'internet tax' (VPN). Super annoying! Given Australia doesn't even require Age Verification on porn sites (only on social media sites), the incentives hint this was strongly supported by legacy media (90% of Aussie media is owned by two companies, Newscorp and Nine Entertainment). The internet licence will make it diffi…

> of course, legacy sources are not affected - incidentally, they're probably more harmful than the prohibited sources What a silly idea. The modern world was built while traditional media existed. The decay and backsliding conicides with modern day social media. How does that point to traditional media being the culprit?

In the extremes, both ideas are right. In terms of timeliness, relevance, quality, rigour, variety, discussion and debate the worst content on social media is orders of magnitude worse than the worst content on mainstream media.

But the inverse is also true: the best content on social media is orders of magnitude better than the best content on mainstream media.

An individual should be able to choose what works for them, not have the government disallow swaths of sources.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#24

Post by nomilk »

Aeolun wrote: post #12
nomilk wrote: post #6

The choice citizens have now is between an 'internet licence' (submit ID's to myriad sites), or an 'internet tax' (VPN). Super annoying! Given Australia doesn't even require Age Verification on porn sites (only on social media sites), the incentives hint this was strongly supported by legacy media (90% of Aussie media is owned by two companies, Newscorp and Nine Entertainment). The internet licence will make it diffi…

> The internet licence will make it difficult for both authors and readers on alternative media platforms Not really? Like the article says, they’ll just go to sites that don’t require age verification.

Hard to argue that isn't an inconvenience. In other words, the outcome is the same, but thanks to government intervention, everyone's worse off.

A good example of where social media can really matter is for say, gay kids in a religious households, where they might not be able to talk to someone in person. Social media makes it easy to create a dummy account and visit forums for advice or reassurance.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#26

Post by txrx0000 »

It's much easier to implement user-configurable client-side filters at the application and OS level than censor the entire Internet.

But of course that's not what it's about.

Online age verification and content moderation was never about protecting anyone. It's about controlling the masses and tricking them into believing that it's for their own good.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#27

Post by jolmg »

modernerd wrote: post #13
ngruhn wrote: post #4

Google can probably infer what I had for breakfast from the way I move the cursor. Can't we have ID-less age verification somehow? Sure, it won't be 100% accurate but keeping out 90% of the kids is a win.

Google launched ID-less age approximation in July in the US: https://blog.google/technology/safety-security/age-assurance...

> Age verification: If we incorrectly estimate a user to be under 18, the user has the option to correct their age, including by uploading a photo of their government ID or a selfie.

Hopefully false positives won't be set high and this abused as an excuse to obtain sensitive personal information on their users.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#28

Post by kcrwfrd_ »

ngruhn wrote: post #4

Google can probably infer what I had for breakfast from the way I move the cursor. Can't we have ID-less age verification somehow? Sure, it won't be 100% accurate but keeping out 90% of the kids is a win.

They should just do something like have parental controls that can configure the user agent with the user’s age, and require adult websites to not serve underage users.

It wouldn’t deter kids if you want to let them have unsupervised root access to a computer (like I enjoyed when I was 12), but I think it would be fairly effective for a walled garden like an iPhone

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#29

Post by general1465 »

nomilk wrote: post #6

The choice citizens have now is between an 'internet licence' (submit ID's to myriad sites), or an 'internet tax' (VPN). Super annoying! Given Australia doesn't even require Age Verification on porn sites (only on social media sites), the incentives hint this was strongly supported by legacy media (90% of Aussie media is owned by two companies, Newscorp and Nine Entertainment). The internet licence will make it diffi…

> Given Australia doesn't even require Age Verification on porn sites (only on social media sites)

Am I only one who sees loophole in creating a social media site, which will be a porn site first? FaceHub or Pornbook.

Re: Age verification doesn’t work

#30

Post by jjcob »

jakobnissen wrote: post #21
ckbkr10 wrote: post #8

I wish there was a honest discussion, I am with them about parents not giving a shit and pushing away responsibility. The idea of supervision in education institutions is good as well. The kids in my family were well protected and supervised, they got into contact with hardcore porn at the age of 6 when other kids had access to smartphones and exposed them to it. I would like to see a honest discussion about the impa…

But kids (and adults) are exposed to all kinds of fantasies. War is not like Call of Duty. The Mafia is not like GTA. Monarchy is not like in the fairy tales. Romance is not like Twilight. BDSM is not like 50 Shades of Grey. For all these things, we rely on people's world experience and common sense to figure it out. I think it's pretty obvious that sex is not like porn, and I don't understand why so many people are…

People can't tell the difference in any domain. People copy what they see. It's why James Bond stopped smoking in movies, and people smoke far less now.

Mainstream porn sites show a lot of weird practices (what's up with that strangulation fetish??) and I do think it has a bad influence.

I don't think age verification is a good solution, because we don't become immune to influence at age 18. Adults are just as vulnerable to copying poor behavior as minors.

I think we should do the opposite: Remove stigma associated with sexuality. Why can't more movies just include everyday sex scenes? Why do we need to make this distinction where you need to go to a different site if you want to see something more explicit than a nipple? Most people probably wouldn't even go to porn sites if they could just watch something steamy on Netflix.

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