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Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

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Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#21

Post by opello »

ofjcihen wrote: post #18
kurikuri wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do know, however, that if you take private data from your employer and leak it (or sell it) you’re not going to be on the right side of the law. I have a hard time buying this article’s point that it was just “violating company policy” If I were to copy the files on my work device and distribute them, I would be in violation of NDAs which could be pursued as civil offenses. If I didn’t have those NDAs, my employe…

As a DLP professional: please don’t tell people this. You can absolutely be arrested and prosecuted for this.

What's the charge for the arrest? I thought legally intellectual property wasn't "real property." If it actually was a trade secret, it might make more sense.

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#22

Post by opello »

noitpmeder wrote: post #16
kurikuri wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do know, however, that if you take private data from your employer and leak it (or sell it) you’re not going to be on the right side of the law. I have a hard time buying this article’s point that it was just “violating company policy” If I were to copy the files on my work device and distribute them, I would be in violation of NDAs which could be pursued as civil offenses. If I didn’t have those NDAs, my employe…

I mean in the first case you're literally stealing from your employer. If that doesn't make you a criminal for theft I don't know what does

But the footage isn't "real property" as I understand it. The only thing the theft does is deprive the company from the opportunity to sell the footage themselves, and it's not exactly like selling security camera footage is the business model of many/any(?) company.

If the harm is that the company couldn't sell the footage itself, the remedy should be giving the company the money from the sale.

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#23

Post by uoaei »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #19
johnhess wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the law" is the fulcrum this turns on. if you wrong your employer, for example by failing to do your job well, you are not a criminal to be prosecuted by the state. you may well deserve to lose that job though. here, wronging your employer is considered a criminal act.

> if you wrong your employer, for example by failing to do your job well, you are not a criminal to be prosecuted by the state This is going out of one’s way to abuse the employer’s trust. Moreover, it’s stealing their stuff. If I take cash out of a till, my employer should have the option of pressing charges. Where I agree with you is that this isn’t computer fraud and abuse. It’s closer to theft. The law used to pr…

"stuff" being technically, legally, IP

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#24

Post by opello »

johnhess wrote: post #12
Aurornis wrote: post #9

Note that CNN isn’t in trouble for reporting this, the person who exfiltrated the footage is. Stealing security camera footage and giving (or possibly selling) it is a problem. This article tries to make a case that the law applied wasn’t correct on somewhat pedantic terms, but I don’t know enough about the law to know if they have a point or not. I do know, however, that if you take private data from your employer a…

"the law" is the fulcrum this turns on. if you wrong your employer, for example by failing to do your job well, you are not a criminal to be prosecuted by the state. you may well deserve to lose that job though. here, wronging your employer is considered a criminal act.

And it seems like that law requires malicious intent. I wonder how that would be proven here?

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#25

Post by [deleted] »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #19
johnhess wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the law" is the fulcrum this turns on. if you wrong your employer, for example by failing to do your job well, you are not a criminal to be prosecuted by the state. you may well deserve to lose that job though. here, wronging your employer is considered a criminal act.

> if you wrong your employer, for example by failing to do your job well, you are not a criminal to be prosecuted by the state This is going out of one’s way to abuse the employer’s trust. Moreover, it’s stealing their stuff. If I take cash out of a till, my employer should have the option of pressing charges. Where I agree with you is that this isn’t computer fraud and abuse. It’s closer to theft. The law used to pr…

[deleted]

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#26

Post by ofjcihen »

opello wrote: post #21
ofjcihen wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a DLP professional: please don’t tell people this. You can absolutely be arrested and prosecuted for this.

What's the charge for the arrest? I thought legally intellectual property wasn't "real property." If it actually was a trade secret, it might make more sense.

Depending on jurisdiction it might be theft, could be something more recently ratified that’s basically made for exactly this purpose. Could also just be a plain old federal CFAA related charge since those are pretty “malleable”.

Again, take these laws seriously and don’t do this.

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#27

Post by fsckboy »

opello wrote: post #21
ofjcihen wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a DLP professional: please don’t tell people this. You can absolutely be arrested and prosecuted for this.

What's the charge for the arrest? I thought legally intellectual property wasn't "real property." If it actually was a trade secret, it might make more sense.

>I thought legally intellectual property wasn't "real property."

if you break into your boss's house and copy his latest recordings (your boss is Stevie Wonder) you are not simply guilty of violating his copyrights.

"computer fraud and abuse act", or who knows how many other laws, are focused on various aspects of "you know you are sneaking about", or even if you don't, tuff noogies.

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#28

Post by tuckerman »

opello wrote: post #21
ofjcihen wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a DLP professional: please don’t tell people this. You can absolutely be arrested and prosecuted for this.

What's the charge for the arrest? I thought legally intellectual property wasn't "real property." If it actually was a trade secret, it might make more sense.

Just because a user has privileges to access files doesn’t mean doing so is permitted for any purpose. Accessing them for this unauthorized purpose is likely computer fraud, at least under California law as I understand it.

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#29

Post by userbinator »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #20
ajross wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that an even stronger argument that the leak shouldn't be criminal?

No, for the same that stealing an item isn’t okay because there is more in the back.

You can infinitely "steal" digital data. That's where the analogy breaks down.

Imaginary property is imaginary.

Re: Computer fraud laws used to prosecute leaking air crash footage to CNN

#30

Post by s_dev »

iowemoretohim wrote: post #6
Validark wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Why is leaking the video the right thing? There were multiple videos of the incident including footage from a EarthCam live camera. And the NTSB released multiple videos as part of their investigation. The video wasn't leaked in order to stop a coverup.

>Why is leaking the video the right thing?

Because it's in the public interest. The law doesn't state what's right only what's permitted.

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