I'd tell the bully "no deal" if I don't get controlling interest, and thus full control of the board.
US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
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Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#22This whole economy by corruption and coercion is not going to work out.
I don't see how it can't work at least short term, when the US is by a long margin the world leading military and economic power. Why else has the US been overspending on military for decades and planting military bases and nuclear submarines all over the world, to become the world hegemony, if not to bully everyone in doing its bidding when push comes to shove? I'm not defending the actions of the US, I'm just askin…
The US margin on economic power isn't all that great, by GDP/PPP it's a long way behind China.
Though from the POV of economic coercion, the question is probably more like "what's the USA's import/export market like relative to all my markets including domestic?", which is going to vary wildly by industry.
> Ally with China, Iran and Russia to fight the US?
Replace Iran with the EU, and yes, some or all of them.
> EU as much as they dislike the US, has a laundry list of urgent domestic issues like Russia,
Urgent, but affordable.
> no cheap energy, no tech industry,
Energy isn't meaningfully worse than anyone else, lots of tech but it's mostly local rather than global in scale
> ageing population, economic stagnation or even decline,
Like everyone else, including the USA
> collapsing welfare system
News to me. Also: Wasn't the USA's supposed to collapsing since Obama took power?
But also, not a unified welfare system over all member nations of the EU.
> illegal immigration leading to a rise right wing extremism leading to crackdowns on freedom of speech and censorship.
Is it, or is that a narrative? And specifically, is it doing this worse than the USA today?
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#23Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't see how it can't work at least short term, when the US is by a long margin the world leading military and economic power. Why else has the US been overspending on military for decades and planting military bases and nuclear submarines all over the world, to become the world hegemony, if not to bully everyone in doing its bidding when push comes to shove? I'm not defending the actions of the US, I'm just askin…
It will not work out over the long run. This is corruption; it breeds corruption, and corruption creates victims. Victims don't put up with it forever and as the old cold case appeal spiel goes, "alliances shift over time". More prosaically, in the short term: TSMC are now effectively compelled to acquire Intel entirely or at least a controlling share, right? Unless Trump's shakedown requires them to own 49% but then…
TSMC is not going to get over the 50% threshold because it has no free will in this whole matter, as the very existence of Taiwan, and hence of TSMC, depends on the political will of the US.
Otherwise I fully agree with you, this will definitely not work out in the long run, but who cares about the long run anymore in this day and age?
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#24This whole economy by corruption and coercion is not going to work out.
It has historically worked pretty well, for several centuries at a time. Are you saying there’s something different this time ?
How is that Tiktok forced sale going though?
The longer Trump creates a legal black hole carve-out for Tiktok, the less anyone will want to buy it. Because he is and this action is transparently corrupt, and it taints the buyer.
And that is true of the participants of any of these forced transfers; they paint targets on their back for future manipulation by the Trump executive. (Which increasingly feels like it should be described as a regime)
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#25I'm kinda of shocked that chip & many tech companies play ball.. They are a required / no alternatives industry by so much of the USA, with limited alternatives. Is it really more cost-effective for each of these companies to spend hundreds of billions of dollars to avoid tariffs when they could easily pass on these costs because we have no alternatives?
Honestly, this is a win-win for TSMC. Intel isn't dead. They've made some bad choices and investments but they're still huge. They have $30 billion in gross profit per year on an utterly boring, non-hype based business model. Get rid of some dead weight, write off the bad investments, improve their foundry business and their value easily grows multiples of what it currently is. On top of it already being a shrewd bus…
If it were a win-win relative to their other options, they wouldn't have to be forced into it. They may have been able to make the best of it, but let's not pretend value is being created.
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#26"If we pay the Dane, certainly he won't ever come back for more Danegeld."
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#27This whole economy by corruption and coercion is not going to work out.
I don't see how it can't work at least short term, when the US is by a long margin the world leading military and economic power. Why else has the US been overspending on military for decades and planting military bases and nuclear submarines all over the world, to become the world hegemony, if not to bully everyone in doing its bidding when push comes to shove? I'm not defending the actions of the US, I'm just askin…
When all your military spending can't help you win against a third-world country (USA in Afghanistan) or a single country 1/3 your size (Russia in Ukraine), it really makes you wonder if all that spending is justified to uphold one big bluff.
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't see how it can't work at least short term, when the US is by a long margin the world leading military and economic power. Why else has the US been overspending on military for decades and planting military bases and nuclear submarines all over the world, to become the world hegemony, if not to bully everyone in doing its bidding when push comes to shove? I'm not defending the actions of the US, I'm just askin…
China seems to be working on catching up, and if you remove all of your soft power maybe they look more attractive?
Oh and TSMC is on an island they claim is their own. Great: an Intel that has TSMC as its largest single shareholder is essentially wholly under the thumb of the State Department.
Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#29Re: US reportedly forcing TSMC to buy 49% stake in Intel to secure tariff relief
#30I'm kinda of shocked that chip & many tech companies play ball.. They are a required / no alternatives industry by so much of the USA, with limited alternatives. Is it really more cost-effective for each of these companies to spend hundreds of billions of dollars to avoid tariffs when they could easily pass on these costs because we have no alternatives?
Honestly, this is a win-win for TSMC. Intel isn't dead. They've made some bad choices and investments but they're still huge. They have $30 billion in gross profit per year on an utterly boring, non-hype based business model. Get rid of some dead weight, write off the bad investments, improve their foundry business and their value easily grows multiples of what it currently is. On top of it already being a shrewd bus…
But the US government has proven to be unreliable in maintaining commitments -- even words on paper are meaningless as it doesn't seem to stop them from changing the deal later and demanding more ("I have change the terms of our agreement, pray I do not alter them further"), and then another request demanding more. Would TSMC be doing the government a favor and gaining protection, or are they being extorted? ("would sure be a shame if we doubled your tariffs again...")