De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR • Hacker News Board

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#21

Post by stuxnet79 » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:30 PM UTC

TarikHassan3 wrote: post #2

Great article, and I'm glad to see privacy being a focus in a cryptocurrency, but I would like to see some other sources that aren't also promoting the token. That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

> That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

Brightest future in terms of what? Traction? Market cap? This is what I thought 7 years ago, and I beefed up my XMR position as a result. Meanwhile, Bitcoin an objectively inferior technology, has 25x since then.

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#22

Post by candiddevmike » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:34 PM UTC

TarikHassan3 wrote: post #2

Great article, and I'm glad to see privacy being a focus in a cryptocurrency, but I would like to see some other sources that aren't also promoting the token. That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

Preface this by saying I am not a fan of any cryptocurrency, but I really struggle to understand why Monero has a smaller market cap than BTC. It has to be inertia related right? Monero just seems like a fundamentally better piece of technology.

Are there scaling issues with Monero, similar/worse than BTC?

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#23

Post by arccy » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:42 PM UTC

OsrsNeedsf2P wrote: post #18

TBaaddi wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Monero has been used and proven for over a decade. No one wants to switch to some unknown tech with an unknown development team.

How much of the Monero development team is actually known? Last I checked some of their core team were anonymous but that might have changed

known as in have a proven reputation / track record.

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#24

Post by yieldcrv » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:42 PM UTC

FabHK wrote: post #15

Fun fact: After some $330m of BTC were stolen last month, Monero spiked 40%+, presumably because the proceeds of that theft were laundered. https://x.com/zachxbt/status/1916756932763046273

> presumably because the proceeds of that theft were laundered

this phrase highlights some really common but unnecessary misunderstandings

1) the proceeds swapped to Monero. there is nothing "presumably" about that because we can see they were swapped to Monero. It isn't a correlation, the instant exchanges show and retain records that they were swapped to Monero.

2) they are unlinking the origin and destination of illicitly obtained funds, so that is laundering BUT

3) its equally as likely that Monero is the destination. there is no further swapping out to hide. no further laundering to complete. Monero can be used to purchase goods, services, and invest with as well. I think this is as misunderstood as people actually wanting to hold bitcoin was 10 years ago.

4) Monero is an old coin, from one of the first crypto cycles, one thing that's held people back from using it and other mixers is the liquidity. If a large hack of funds used any one of them, then most of the funds coming out would be probabilistically part of the hack and illicit. But if MANY of the hacks used it and other licit sources, this would improve the liquidity for everyone and other hacks. Liquidity begets liquidity. It was only a matter of time before someone started it.

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#25

Post by dboreham » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:42 PM UTC

candiddevmike wrote: post #22

TarikHassan3 wrote: post #2

Great article, and I'm glad to see privacy being a focus in a cryptocurrency, but I would like to see some other sources that aren't also promoting the token. That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

Preface this by saying I am not a fan of any cryptocurrency, but I really struggle to understand why Monero has a smaller market cap than BTC. It has to be inertia related right? Monero just seems like a fundamentally better piece of technology. Are there scaling issues with Monero, similar/worse than BTC?

> better piece of technology

Technology quality is uncorrelated with market cap. This would be like saying Frontier Airlines should have a higher market cap than United because one uses Linux and the other is still on mainframes..

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#26

Post by PokedBear » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:43 PM UTC

candiddevmike wrote: post #22

TarikHassan3 wrote: post #2

Great article, and I'm glad to see privacy being a focus in a cryptocurrency, but I would like to see some other sources that aren't also promoting the token. That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

Preface this by saying I am not a fan of any cryptocurrency, but I really struggle to understand why Monero has a smaller market cap than BTC. It has to be inertia related right? Monero just seems like a fundamentally better piece of technology. Are there scaling issues with Monero, similar/worse than BTC?

It doesn't need a lot of speculative value in order to be useful. It just needs enough value to make the transactions meaningful. And that means people are a lot less likely to drive up the price via speculation.

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#27

Post by ujkhsjkdhf234 » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:45 PM UTC

candiddevmike wrote: post #22

TarikHassan3 wrote: post #2

Great article, and I'm glad to see privacy being a focus in a cryptocurrency, but I would like to see some other sources that aren't also promoting the token. That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

Preface this by saying I am not a fan of any cryptocurrency, but I really struggle to understand why Monero has a smaller market cap than BTC. It has to be inertia related right? Monero just seems like a fundamentally better piece of technology. Are there scaling issues with Monero, similar/worse than BTC?

BTC is not about usefulness. The Bitcoin community has abandoned all of the original principles that made them. It is now just about line goes up and make money.

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#28

Post by ujkhsjkdhf234 » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:46 PM UTC

ChrisfromLees wrote: post #7

stasmo wrote: post #6

If the US debt problem leads to capital controls, using Monero will become a federal offence overnight. Might as well call it money-laundering coin.

Do you think that is a likely scenario under this government?

Yes. I would bet on it. Certain Democrats don't like Monero because of the criminal activity around it. If the king told Republicans to ban it, they would be able to get enough Dems on board to avoid any filibuster problems.

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#29

Post by tromp » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:46 PM UTC

candiddevmike wrote: post #22

TarikHassan3 wrote: post #2

Great article, and I'm glad to see privacy being a focus in a cryptocurrency, but I would like to see some other sources that aren't also promoting the token. That said, I do think it's got the brightest future of any coin besides BTC for the very reason.

Preface this by saying I am not a fan of any cryptocurrency, but I really struggle to understand why Monero has a smaller market cap than BTC. It has to be inertia related right? Monero just seems like a fundamentally better piece of technology. Are there scaling issues with Monero, similar/worse than BTC?

Yes, it scales much worse:

* node resources scale with the size of the UTXO set (unspent outputs), which in Monero's case balloons to the entire TXO set (all outputs, orders of magnitude larger)

* a typical 2-input 2-output transaction is 4 times larger

* wallets have to track all outputs to choose random decoys for transaction inputs

One can argue that this is the price to pay for significantly better privacy, but the largest benefits come from having no visible amounts or addresses, which can be achieved with significantly better scalability than BTC [1].

[1] https://forum.grin.mw/t/scalability-vs-privacy-chart/8114

Re: De-anonymization attacks against the privacy coin XMR

#30

Post by yieldcrv » Wed, May 28, 2025, 4:48 PM UTC

stasmo wrote: post #6

If the US debt problem leads to capital controls, using Monero will become a federal offence overnight. Might as well call it money-laundering coin.

> Might as well call it money-laundering coin

The state's concept of money is private and it has just enjoyed help in getting data about electronic ledgers for the last 55 years, by deputizing banks. And for the last 18 it has also enjoyed public ledgers of crypto currencies.

But the successful stigma of financial privacy doesn't invent its right to having data. This is just a privilege, and private money is a reversion to the mean.