What would said tech independence actually take? Which American services would be highest priority to replace?
In other words, if I were an EU startup, who should I compete with/try to clone?
Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
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Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
2 things happen repeatedly in the European tech scene: you get large enough to be noticed by Google, MS, Amazon, and they acquire you. Or, in order to continue to scale you move the entire company to SV, ie Spotify. If the EU stepped in to block the acquisition or corporate move, in order to keep their tech homegrown, it would be seen as government overreach and not respecting the free markets.
Maybe it's time we realize free markets are ... bad sometimes? Why are we sacrificing our sovereignty to an abstract ideology?
Maybe it’s time to realize that the free markets aren’t as free as claimed
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#23I'd love to see the EU aggressively expand investment in the Linux desktop. I'd absolutely drop my job and jump on FOSS projects if there was financial incentive to do so - I'd even take a hit on compensation to participate.
Same, I'd love if the EU sponsored the development of open source alternatives. I'm tired of the American tech industry and how it's towing the (anti-European) party line - just give me a way to make a living while building competitors!
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#24I don't think MS has anything to worry about until Europe can ship something other than policy. As much as I'd like them to it's not a place of making things happen, it's a place of trying to make the other places where things are actually built do what they say.
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
2 things happen repeatedly in the European tech scene: you get large enough to be noticed by Google, MS, Amazon, and they acquire you. Or, in order to continue to scale you move the entire company to SV, ie Spotify. If the EU stepped in to block the acquisition or corporate move, in order to keep their tech homegrown, it would be seen as government overreach and not respecting the free markets.
Maybe it's time we realize free markets are ... bad sometimes? Why are we sacrificing our sovereignty to an abstract ideology?
Because if the EU steps in to stop this you couldn't scale because the EU isn't one big market like the USA it is a bunch of smaller markets that add up to a big markert that all have their version of how things should go. If the EU wants to have hyperscalers like the USA they will at some point need to force EU members to do things like relax language requirements, have more overlapping business law, etc.
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe it's time we realize free markets are ... bad sometimes? Why are we sacrificing our sovereignty to an abstract ideology?
Because if the EU steps in to stop this you couldn't scale because the EU isn't one big market like the USA it is a bunch of smaller markets that add up to a big markert that all have their version of how things should go. If the EU wants to have hyperscalers like the USA they will at some point need to force EU members to do things like relax language requirements, have more overlapping business law, etc.
Yes, I fully agree - this is a super important thing the EU needs to do if it wants any chance at homegrown competition.
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#27That’s appreciated but not sure that’s enough.
Think everyone knows US spy agencies will just help themselves to the data anyway regardless of the legal details. Thats just the reality of today’s world. And beyond that with how DOGE seems to be raiding whatever data they want under questionable circumstances I don’t think the issue is limited to NSA and friends.
On that basis the only choice seems to be to move away from US providers
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#28> "The Cloud Act grants US authorities access to cloud data hosted by US companies. It does not matter if that data is located in the US, Europe, or anywhere else." Exactly. So long as that is true, the idea that an EU datacenter run by Microsoft can be "sovereign" is nonsense. Having an in-EU owned cloud becomes a national security issue. Tech independence is a long way off though. I wonder if, like the carbon trans…
I dealt with a EU//German regulator in the past about this very topic in a finance context. This behavior is peak willful ignorance. Its sold as risk planing by EU entities but after all its just liability planing. What I mean by that is, for convenience reasons everyone goes along with US Clouds knowing it is technically absolutely possible to access the data but as long the contracts are clean and state they are fo…
There are a few worries. The US government accessing private data is the one that gets this treatment. Sure, the contracts are not worth the paper they're written on, but it's a state actor - even if you store the data only on a USB stick in your wallet in the end they'll find a way to access it. Preventing data leaks to private parties is a more attainable objective, and using a US cloud might actually contribute positively to that.
The new worry is different; denial of service. Your bank can just Go Away one day. Like what happened to Amsterdam-based, but Russian owned, ATB bank. Its cloud resources were blocked and even the Dutch bankruptcy court had trouble getting access to the data to wind down the bank.
That's an existential threat. One you can ignore if your values are aligned with the US administration, but the administration is completely unpredictable, not to say nihilistic. This is making companies very (very) nervous, even without the regulator saying anything to them.
Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#29Re: Microsoft gets twitchy over talk of Europe's tech independence
#30I don't think MS has anything to worry about until Europe can ship something other than policy. As much as I'd like them to it's not a place of making things happen, it's a place of trying to make the other places where things are actually built do what they say.
Hmm... If Europe has no industry, how do they pay for American Clouds?