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Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

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Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#21

Post by amluto »

poincaredisk wrote: post #14
nharada wrote: post #12

I really like uv, and it's the first package manager for a while where I haven't felt like it's a minor improvement on what I'm using but ultimately something better will come out a year or two later. I'd love if we standardized on it as a community as the de facto default, especially for new folks coming in. I personally now recommend it to nearly everyone, instead of the "welllll I use poetry but pyenv works or you…

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

If you switch to uv, you’ll have fewer excuses to take coffee breaks while waiting for pip to do its thing. :)

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#22

Post by remus »

poincaredisk wrote: post #14
nharada wrote: post #12

I really like uv, and it's the first package manager for a while where I haven't felt like it's a minor improvement on what I'm using but ultimately something better will come out a year or two later. I'd love if we standardized on it as a community as the de facto default, especially for new folks coming in. I personally now recommend it to nearly everyone, instead of the "welllll I use poetry but pyenv works or you…

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

Pip doesn't resolve dependencies for you. On small projects that can be ok, but if you're working on something medium to large, or you're working on it with other people you can quickly get yourself into a sticky situation where your environment isn't easily reproducible.

Using uv means your project will have well defined dependencies.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#23

Post by markerz »

poincaredisk wrote: post #14
nharada wrote: post #12

I really like uv, and it's the first package manager for a while where I haven't felt like it's a minor improvement on what I'm using but ultimately something better will come out a year or two later. I'd love if we standardized on it as a community as the de facto default, especially for new folks coming in. I personally now recommend it to nearly everyone, instead of the "welllll I use poetry but pyenv works or you…

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

Yeah, it unifies the whole env experience with the package installation experience. No more forgetting to activate virtualenv first. No more pip installing into the wrong virtual env or accidentally borrowing from the system packages. It’s way easier to specify which version of python to use. Everything is version controlled including python version and variant like cpython, puppy, etc. it’s also REALLY REALLY fast.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#24

Post by 2wrist »

poincaredisk wrote: post #14
nharada wrote: post #12

I really like uv, and it's the first package manager for a while where I haven't felt like it's a minor improvement on what I'm using but ultimately something better will come out a year or two later. I'd love if we standardized on it as a community as the de facto default, especially for new folks coming in. I personally now recommend it to nearly everyone, instead of the "welllll I use poetry but pyenv works or you…

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

Also you can set the python version for that project. It will download whatever version you need and just use it.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#25

Post by mardifoufs »

poincaredisk wrote: post #14
nharada wrote: post #12

I really like uv, and it's the first package manager for a while where I haven't felt like it's a minor improvement on what I'm using but ultimately something better will come out a year or two later. I'd love if we standardized on it as a community as the de facto default, especially for new folks coming in. I personally now recommend it to nearly everyone, instead of the "welllll I use poetry but pyenv works or you…

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

Well, for one you can't actually package or add a local requirement (for example , a vendored package) to the usual pip requirements.txt (or with pyproject.toml, or any other standard way) afaik.

I saw a discourse reply that cited some sort of possible security issue but that was basically it and that means that the only way to get that functionality is to not use pip. It's really not a lot of major stuff, just a lot of little paper cuts that makes it a lot easier to just use something else once your project gets to a certain size.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#26

Post by stevage »

As a NodeJS developer it's still kind of shocking to me that Python still hasn't resolved this mess. Node isn't perfect, and dealing with different versions of Node is annoying, but at least there's none of this "worry about modifying global environment" stuff.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#27

Post by mosselman »

poincaredisk wrote: post #14
nharada wrote: post #12

I really like uv, and it's the first package manager for a while where I haven't felt like it's a minor improvement on what I'm using but ultimately something better will come out a year or two later. I'd love if we standardized on it as a community as the de facto default, especially for new folks coming in. I personally now recommend it to nearly everyone, instead of the "welllll I use poetry but pyenv works or you…

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

I am not a python developer, but sometimes I use python projects. This puts me in a position where I need to get stuff working while knowing almost nothing about how python package management works.

Also I don’t recognise errors and I don’t know which python versions generally work well with what.

I’ve had it happen so often with pip that I’d have something setup just fine. Let’s say some stable diffusion ui. Then some other month I want to experiment with something like airbyte. Can’t get it working at all. Then some days later I think, let’s generate an image. Only to find out that with pip installing all sorts of stuff for airbyte, I’ve messed up my stable diffusion install somehow.

Uv clicked right away for me and I don’t have any of these issues.

Was I using pip and asdf incorrectly before? Probably. Was it worth learning how to do it properly in the previous way? Nope. So uv is really great for me.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#28

Post by aidos »

mplewis wrote: post #19
poincaredisk wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

Pip only has requirements.txt and doesn't have lockfiles, so you can't guarantee that the bugs you're seeing on your system are the same as the bugs on your production system.

I’ve always worked around that by having a requirements.base.txt and a requirements.txt for the locked versions. Obviously pip doesn’t do that for you but it’s not hard to manage yourself.

Having said that, I’m going to give uv a shot because I hear so many good things about it.

Re: Uv's killer feature is making ad-hoc environments easy

#30

Post by mosselman »

remus wrote: post #22
poincaredisk wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never used anything other than pip. I never felt the need to use anything other than pip (with virtualenv). Am I missing anything?

Pip doesn't resolve dependencies for you. On small projects that can be ok, but if you're working on something medium to large, or you're working on it with other people you can quickly get yourself into a sticky situation where your environment isn't easily reproducible. Using uv means your project will have well defined dependencies.

Oh wow it doesn’t? What DOES it do then?

As I commented here just now I never got pip. This explains it.

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