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The Future of European Competitiveness

commission.europa.eu

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Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#21

Post by izacus »

moi2388 wrote: post #18
Mistletoe wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is though that I want to move to Europe precisely for all these same reasons. And I want to do it with my USA dollars and wealth that enabled it, so I do recognize the dissonance there. Are Europeans happier due to all of the reasons you listed? Do you enable wealth to grow at the expense of the happiness of its residents if you implement the reforms needed to “move fast and break things”? Are Americans hap…

I suppose the truth/ideal situation would be somewhere in the middle. But the inability to capitalise on the tech sector, difficult regulations as barrier to entry, and a lot of changing rules regarding innovation, making things “green” and environmental and consumer safety does give a high burden to industry when competing with entities like China and the USA which do not have these restrictions. I think a long-term…

My two cents are that EU needs to follow USA with aggressive protectionism to offset the regulation.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#22

Post by clarionbell »

Mistletoe wrote: post #15
frankjr wrote: post #5

> Europe largely missed out on the digital revolution led by the internet and the productivity gains it brought: in fact, the productivity gap between the EU and the US is largely explained by the tech sector. The EU is weak in the emerging technologies that will drive future growth. Only four of the world’s top 50 tech companies are European. > Europe is stuck in a static industrial structure with few new companies…

The thing is though that I want to move to Europe precisely for all these same reasons. And I want to do it with my USA dollars and wealth that enabled it, so I do recognize the dissonance there. Are Europeans happier due to all of the reasons you listed? Do you enable wealth to grow at the expense of the happiness of its residents if you implement the reforms needed to “move fast and break things”? Are Americans hap…

Problem is that it's not sustainable. We can't defend ourselves, our economies are de-industrializing, we have right and left radical taking over political spectrum all the while our pension and healthcare systems are moving ever closer to a breaking point.

The careful approach may have brought as pretty far. But isn't working anymore. It hasn't worked since 2008 at least.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#23

Post by AlanYx »

lsy wrote: post #14

I suspect it is actually a great strength of Europe that the attitude towards regulation (to put it perhaps overly simplistically, favoring more intangible rights over economic growth) precludes hype and bubble phenomena like the mentioned "creation of large, integrated data sets" or "young, innovative tech companies". This means that business, at least to some extent, is forced to address real-world issues and work…

>This means that business, at least to some extent, is forced to address real-world issues and work at a more local level.

If the regulatory burden prevents local businesses from getting off the ground because only foreign businesses have the deep pockets to comply ("The net effect of this burden of regulation is that only larger companies – which are often non-EU based – have the financial capacity and incentive to bear the costs of complying."), then in some sense these regulations work against the goal of issues being addressed at a local level.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#24

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

frankjr wrote: post #5

> Europe largely missed out on the digital revolution led by the internet and the productivity gains it brought: in fact, the productivity gap between the EU and the US is largely explained by the tech sector. The EU is weak in the emerging technologies that will drive future growth. Only four of the world’s top 50 tech companies are European. > Europe is stuck in a static industrial structure with few new companies…

> Probably not what the self patting EU clowns were expecting.

I don't know who you have in mind with "self petting EU clowns" but in general people are very aware of what's going on. A lot of companies have been giving this feedback for a long time.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#25

Post by renewiltord »

Mistletoe wrote: post #15
frankjr wrote: post #5

> Europe largely missed out on the digital revolution led by the internet and the productivity gains it brought: in fact, the productivity gap between the EU and the US is largely explained by the tech sector. The EU is weak in the emerging technologies that will drive future growth. Only four of the world’s top 50 tech companies are European. > Europe is stuck in a static industrial structure with few new companies…

The thing is though that I want to move to Europe precisely for all these same reasons. And I want to do it with my USA dollars and wealth that enabled it, so I do recognize the dissonance there. Are Europeans happier due to all of the reasons you listed? Do you enable wealth to grow at the expense of the happiness of its residents if you implement the reforms needed to “move fast and break things”? Are Americans hap…

No. That's normal. Getting rich and moving to a place where labour is cheap is a pretty good strategy.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#26

Post by psychoslave »

Competition is for losers, and (some?) American leaders got it in mind for a long time https://www.wsj.com/articles/peter-thiel-competition-is-for-... but we don't need to stop faking like the rules of the game are useful and fruitful in the American way.

As Europeans, we don't need Europe to compete or even out-compete other actors. We need strong will and operational effectiveness to foster social, economical, technological and ecological progresses all together.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#27

Post by silverquiet »

clarionbell wrote: post #22
Mistletoe wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The thing is though that I want to move to Europe precisely for all these same reasons. And I want to do it with my USA dollars and wealth that enabled it, so I do recognize the dissonance there. Are Europeans happier due to all of the reasons you listed? Do you enable wealth to grow at the expense of the happiness of its residents if you implement the reforms needed to “move fast and break things”? Are Americans hap…

Problem is that it's not sustainable. We can't defend ourselves, our economies are de-industrializing, we have right and left radical taking over political spectrum all the while our pension and healthcare systems are moving ever closer to a breaking point. The careful approach may have brought as pretty far. But isn't working anymore. It hasn't worked since 2008 at least.

> We can't defend ourselves, our economies are de-industrializing, we have right and left radical taking over political spectrum all the while our pension and healthcare systems are moving ever closer to a breaking point.

Other than the defense part, the same could be said for the US.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#28

Post by tway_GdBRwW »

teamspirit wrote: post #9

It feels like America innovates and the EU regulates. Personally I’d like to see each do more of the other. But would that hamper the thing they’re doing better at? If America regulates more will there necessarily be less innovation? For example, there are a number of bills in the CA legislature aimed at regulating the gen ai. I know that if CA makes these things illegal, they’ll just move to jurisdiction where it’s…

A great deal of the innovation I've seen or read about has been pushing costs onto the public or other thefts of the commons. I see how this is a necessary feature of innovation (by definition "innovation" implies a new social contract over how a resource is used). But it is not clear this is a universal good, and the new contract often enriches a few at the expense of the many.

Good regulation defends the commons/the rights of the many.

Good innovation creates a better standard of living for the many.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#29

Post by megaman821 »

lapcat wrote: post #8

As an American, what I've seen, and what the statistics appear to show, is mostly stagnation for the majority of the population. Any modest post-pandemic wage gains have been offset by consumer product inflation. What we experience in the United States is the continuation of a trend going back 40-50 years: disparity of wealth, concentrating at the top. Of course those at the top have experienced spectacular growth in…

What time period are you imagining that it would be better to be in the bottom half of income distribution than now?

All that wealth at the top is tied up in investments. It is moving through the economy; it is not a stockpile of gold coins hidden in a mountain.

Re: The Future of European Competitiveness

#30

Post by VancouverMan »

lapcat wrote: post #8

As an American, what I've seen, and what the statistics appear to show, is mostly stagnation for the majority of the population. Any modest post-pandemic wage gains have been offset by consumer product inflation. What we experience in the United States is the continuation of a trend going back 40-50 years: disparity of wealth, concentrating at the top. Of course those at the top have experienced spectacular growth in…

> Everyone else is experiencing outrageous costs of housing, education, and medical care ...

This shouldn't come as a surprise.

Those three sectors you list have tremendously invasive and widespread government interference, and it has only gotten worse with time.

This government interference inherently creates various types of economic inefficiencies (such as the loss of competition, corruption, wasteful bureaucracy, diverting resources to the unproductive users, etc.) that eventually result in severe distortions throughout the entire economy.

This isn't a problem just in the US, either. It's also happening in Canada, for example, and often to a far worse degree.

Anyone who proposes more government interference as the solution to these government-created problems will inherently be making the situation worse.

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