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'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

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Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#21

Post by Forge36 »

crngefest wrote: post #4
chung8123 wrote: post #3

Smart Technology is great when it is gets over the hump from being dumb, to overly complicated, to being smart and easy to use. I think of my smart lights as an example. They can be dumb (switch operated), they can be overly complex (remove phone, open app, find light, switch on), and they can be just smart (when I am in the room, turn on the lights, use time of day to decide light temperature and brightness).

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

A difference of values? Mine is convenience/cost. I suspect yours is "always works" (possibly a bad guess let me know what your top property is).

I've used smart switches to join otherwise disconnected electrical lines without rewiring my house.

Compare two fans I replaced with a combo fan and light: One is WiFi controlled, other is a remote.

I didn't want to run another electrical line and expand the box.

Disconnecting the wall switch "always on" was optional. The remote takes over both to allow fan or light. There are 5 switches controlling my main living space. Only the fan is "smart". These switches are not co-located.

With a remote: We rarely use the light or fan. With a WiFi (in main bedroom) the light is used daily. Fan can be turned off from the wall, but not on (by choice). Fan also shuts off on schedule.

Ignoring fan costs: Two smart switches cost $25. Can be done in under an half an hour in main living space.

Compare running a new wire: 25ft wire ~$20 New Box: $5 New switch: $17 I need to crawl into attic, move insulation. Also run the wire through the wall.

Is it required? No. Does it make the system more usable? Spouse doesn't know/care. "It just works"

When it doesn't: it's two steps. If you're already doing this: the extra step is nothing lost.

Here's some questions I ask myself:

For $25 what annoyance can I fix this month? And I try to just do it.

Do I have an hour? Can I do it now?

What does this cost over time? This is not of a gamble (I spent much longer than I'd like to admit writing this post).

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#22

Post by DougN7 »

diggan wrote: post #13
crngefest wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

> I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. I've never owned a house/apartment, always rented, fwiw. The best part of having smart lights for me is that I can place my (zigbee) switches wherever I want, as apparently the people deciding where the light switches go, have no idea what they're doing. So first thing when moving to a new place is replacing the bulbs with my own bulbs, and find b…

I know almost nothing about all the smart home tech, but my son-in-law is a tech fanboi that has smart lights everywhere in his home, and some small Alexas in rooms that they are hooked up to. His lights are all voice controlled so they never use switches. Just thought I’d mention it as an option if switch placement is an irritant.

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#23

Post by RajT88 »

crngefest wrote: post #4
chung8123 wrote: post #3

Smart Technology is great when it is gets over the hump from being dumb, to overly complicated, to being smart and easy to use. I think of my smart lights as an example. They can be dumb (switch operated), they can be overly complex (remove phone, open app, find light, switch on), and they can be just smart (when I am in the room, turn on the lights, use time of day to decide light temperature and brightness).

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

I have my entire living room (which also includes the dining room) set up to turn off via voice command.

Why? This covers 4 light switches worth of lights. They also auto-turn off at 1am via Alexa routine. Also I can change the colors of all the lights (and do sometimes - at Xmas parties I have a script which slowly cycles all the lights between green and red).

For sure if I could make all this work cheaply without needing an internet connection, I would do so.

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#24

Post by artificialLimbs »

crngefest wrote: post #4
chung8123 wrote: post #3

Smart Technology is great when it is gets over the hump from being dumb, to overly complicated, to being smart and easy to use. I think of my smart lights as an example. They can be dumb (switch operated), they can be overly complex (remove phone, open app, find light, switch on), and they can be just smart (when I am in the room, turn on the lights, use time of day to decide light temperature and brightness).

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

‘Siri, nighttime’ turns all lights off downstairs except for kitchen, which it dims to 50% and turns on lamp in bedroom. Saves me switching potentially 9 switches manually and adjusting the dimmer.

‘Siri, downstairs off’ when I crawl in bed, and ‘Siri downstairs on’ in the morning.

I can also turn porch lights on from my car when coming home at night.

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#25

Post by lobsterthief »

ethbr1 wrote: post #9

Two observations: - Traditional mechanical switches, locks, etc have a lot of 9's of reliability. - Any smart tech including in my house needs to decrease my cognitive load. That means while it can have setup (even extensive!), after that it better be able to work with less thought, reliably, including when the internet is unavailable. Which generally means simple smart devices with open interfaces. What most smart m…

This is why I love the Lutron line of smart house stuff. Everything is more expensive, but you set it up and it just works as expected every single time.

Also, it uses a local hub so I don’t have 30 black box devices connecting directly to the Internet through my network.

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#26

Post by crngefest »

Forge36 wrote: post #21
crngefest wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

A difference of values? Mine is convenience/cost. I suspect yours is "always works" (possibly a bad guess let me know what your top property is). I've used smart switches to join otherwise disconnected electrical lines without rewiring my house. Compare two fans I replaced with a combo fan and light: One is WiFi controlled, other is a remote. I didn't want to run another electrical line and expand the box. Disconnect…

Thanks for the elaborate reply. I agree that it stems from a difference in values, my guiding one’s are being „always works - is resilient“ and „no unnecessary waste/labour“.

I know my time is extremely limited and while automating things like this might be a fun project I rather spend my time sitting in a park and looking at the trees. But this attitude also leads to living with unnecessary annoyances for a prolonged time sometimes

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#27

Post by crngefest »

thejazzman wrote: post #6
crngefest wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

My hue lights are one of my favorite things. I never have to walk into a dark home, which is especially nice when switches aren't located near doors. I also get a huge boost from tweaking the colors. It's very relaxing and dramatically improves the ambience. If you can't see the appeal there, idk what to tell ya... Using a phone to control them IS a drag, but there are remotes that can toggle through scenes etc. it's…

I have Hue lights actually. I kind of dislike them since they try to nudge me hard to create an account - dark pattern IMO - lights do not need security updates or accounts period.

> Why goto the park and fly a kite when you can just pop a pill?

Weird tangent. I much rather go to the park and chill instead of tinkering away on my smart home setup…

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#28

Post by crngefest »

112233 wrote: post #15
crngefest wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

You can't imagine how much kilometers of in-wall electical cable installation (at least done euro-style) one can avoid by replacing normal light fixtures and switches with a single group relay, some tracks, and some matter bulbs. Once everything is set up and switches are magnetically attched to walls, it works just like the dumb lights, but without 230V all over the place. Just need to swap coin battery once a year.…

That is a fair point but only applies if you are building a new home. I don’t think it’s feasible to retrofit an existing home in this fashion.

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#29

Post by crngefest »

nickthegreek wrote: post #20
crngefest wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

My lights automatically change their color temperature and brightness throughout the day. There is more to smart lights than on and off.

Do they need internet connection to do that? I have the same behaviour with a dumb light that just has some circuits to control the LED.

No smart devices needed to change Color/brightness dynamically.

Re: 'Smart' technology is out of control. We adore this dumb tech

#30

Post by crngefest »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #14
crngefest wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood the need for smart lights for able-bodied people. You just stand up for a moment and flick the switch, what benefit do smart lights or even a remote for lights provide? Even if you disregard all the issues these iot/smart devices have and assume they operate perfectly I really don’t see why we should expend any resources to make them.

There was a time when I needed to wake up very early for a long commute. I seriously considered obtaining and setting up lights that I could schedule to come on at the time I needed to wake up.

You can easily do this with a dumb mechanical clock switch.

No kubernetes backend architecture and AWS pods required here!

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