As I reached about half way through the article I got bored and my mind starting having stray thoughts - god this is long. Isn't it ironic that a superstar programmer would have been bored by now and stopped reading. - momentarily after that, I guess I just admitted that I'm not s superstar programmer. - momentarily after that, I wonder if there are writers who can transmit ten times as much information using one ten…
Super-star programmers
21–30 of 124 posts
Re: Super-star programmers
#22Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're missing the point that the term rock-star programmer doesn't mean they will produce world changing programs. It means they'll do an order of magnitude better/faster than their non-rockstar peers. That might be a bit contradicting to what Joel is explaining. From what I've experienced first hand, there's programmers that can produce similar code/software in a week that takes 5 mediocre programmers to produce in…
Can we please stop using the term "rock star?" It's getting old. This idea that a single programmer is somehow so much better or superior may have its merits, but it's harmful to your overall business if you put all your weight on that single support. You have to accept that above a certain number, your employees will fall on a bell-curve of ability, and you should support the efficiency and productiveness of the ent…
Re: Super-star programmers
#23Forgive potential ignorance here, but people often quote Joel Spolsky as saying things like: "...the trouble with using a lot of mediocre programmers instead of a couple of good ones is that no matter how long they strive, they will still produce something mediocre." What really genius-level things has Fog Creek done? I remember demoing FogBugz, and it was marginally better than its competitors, but it was far from a…
Made himself independently wealthy. Repeatedly (IE: Not luck).
Not that I disagree with you. But that is worthy of respect in itself. Also, there is an art to the very difficult task of making the difficult look simple and easy.
Re: Super-star programmers
#24Forgive potential ignorance here, but people often quote Joel Spolsky as saying things like: "...the trouble with using a lot of mediocre programmers instead of a couple of good ones is that no matter how long they strive, they will still produce something mediocre." What really genius-level things has Fog Creek done? I remember demoing FogBugz, and it was marginally better than its competitors, but it was far from a…
I'm constantly fighting that same urge. The problem is one of domain. UI coding for straightforward data models (which is 90% of all "web" development) just ... isn't very hard or impressive. Great programmers in that regime produce software that is smaller, cleaner, tighter and higher quality. But it's still just a bug database or social thing or web store, etc... Anyone (even mediocre programmers) can look at it an…
I sort of snicker when I see startups post jobs looking for "rock star" coders [1]. What self respecting person would call him or herself a "rock star", let alone apply for such a position? Maybe it's just a gimmick to get mediocre developers to get to work on boilerplate web work..
[1] I also saw a job posting recently where they were looking for a coder "to work on hard problems and blow a hole through the universe"... Why not have them blow bullshit of their face while they're at it? Is this just HR trying to sound too cool, or what?
Re: Super-star programmers
#25Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm constantly fighting that same urge. The problem is one of domain. UI coding for straightforward data models (which is 90% of all "web" development) just ... isn't very hard or impressive. Great programmers in that regime produce software that is smaller, cleaner, tighter and higher quality. But it's still just a bug database or social thing or web store, etc... Anyone (even mediocre programmers) can look at it an…
Although the article never used the word "super star", it's something I see around HN and the startup world quite a bit.... I sort of snicker when I see startups post jobs looking for "rock star" coders [1]. What self respecting person would call him or herself a "rock star", let alone apply for such a position? Maybe it's just a gimmick to get mediocre developers to get to work on boilerplate web work.. [1] I also s…
Re: Super-star programmers
#26I find this is typically due to a difference between the level of abstraction people are modeling in their head. A great coder can flip back and forth between several different levels (the 50m lines of OS code, the 100,000 of app code, the 1,000 of local code, etc) and have a reasonable idea of how those parts fit together. Not a complete understanding, just a basic idea. This is why mediocre programmers are what the…
Re: Super-star programmers
#27The only example here given of the powers of these superprogrammers, is that they have banded together to make an OS that’s technically impressive, but gets no traction in the marketplace and ends up all but forgotten (PC/GEOS)? Not very enticing…
Re: Super-star programmers
#28"An outfit in San Francisco called 'tenXer' has begun testing a service that aims to help people boost their mental accomplishments by up to tenfold—hence its name. . . . "
. . . .
"For those wishing to have a go, tenXer
in San Francisco is currently offering a beta version of its tracking software to help people analyse their own performance, set goals for themselves and improve their lot. At present, the tracking software works only for programmers. But down the road, the same techniques could just as readily be applied to other occupations. . . . "
The great thing about this is that many of us on Hacker News can put the claim to the test. Commenting on the claims of tenXer, which is what the writer for The Economist and several of the commenters here on Hacker News are doing, is interesting, and trying this out and seeing whether or not it works might be even more interesting. It's still unclear how much most individual human beings can improve themselves if they apply effort to self-improvement. It might be a good opportunity for career development for many HN participants to try this out.
Re: Super-star programmers
#29"How strong is the support conferred to the 10x claim by the best-reputed list of references, for a reader persistent enough to follow the chain of citations back to primary sources?
"Based on our close reading of the “10x files”, we can now answer: quite weak.
"Not a single one of the references is to a replication, in the scientific sense of the term, of the original exploratory experiment.
"The empirical data is in general quite old, most if not all of it predating widespread use of the Internet - which we can safely expect to have wrought major changes in programming practice.
"None of the studies address the question of construct validity, that is, how meaningful it is to speak of an individual programmer’s productivity, and if it is meaningful, whether the experimental measurements line up adequately with that meaning."
Don't get me wrong--I've certainly seen 10x (and greater) variations in productivity. But they've been due to factors other than inherent individual capability. They're things like
* technical debt
* familiarity with the codebase and problem domain
* interruptions, distractions, multi-tasking and other office environment issues
* choice of language - but this is a distant fourth compared to other the other three
On top of all this, the Economist article is a thinly-veiled press release for tenXer, which is itself nothing more than an exercise in testerone-fueled egotism. tenXer measures activity, not productivity [2], and I expect the primary result of increasing your tenXer metrics will be less time thinking, more time hacking, and insufferable smugness.
[1] The Leprechauns of Software Engineering explores what science is and how we distinguish between fact and folklore in software engineering. It specifically explores the 10x claim, and determines that it's folklore. http://leanpub.com/leprechauns
[2] Productivity is defined as output over input, and the output of programming is software capability. No one's come up with a good measure of that yet. So any time someone claims they can prove increased productivity, ask them how they measure it. Chances are good you'll get a bogus value that measures activity instead, such as "lines of code." http://martinfowler.com/bliki/CannotMeasureProductivity.html
Re: Super-star programmers
#30I find this is typically due to a difference between the level of abstraction people are modeling in their head. A great coder can flip back and forth between several different levels (the 50m lines of OS code, the 100,000 of app code, the 1,000 of local code, etc) and have a reasonable idea of how those parts fit together. Not a complete understanding, just a basic idea. This is why mediocre programmers are what the…