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Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

theguardian.com

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Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#21

Post by cjk2 »

leohonexus wrote: post #9

I was curious about the legal grounds that schools have to confiscate student's phones for up to a week, and I found this document from the UK government: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/62d1643e8fa8f... Some things that concern me: - Page 19: Staff may examine any data or files on an electronic device they have confiscated as a result of a search, as defined in paragraph 57, if there is good reason to…

I've seen this before. To quote a barrister friend of mine, regardless of the law, it mostly depends on how big a stick the person having their device confiscated wields. The stick in this case is connections, parents etc. They rely purely on submission to enforce this policy. A simple "no" removes consent and their ability to do anything about it. If after that it is forced upon you, then things get "interesting" to quote him because it depends how they try and enforce it.

For example the barrister friend in question's daughter had her phone confiscated and it went missing in custody of the staff. The school disclaimed all responsibility but paid the moneyclaim out for a new phone quietly when the relevant stick was wielded and removed their policy of confiscation immediately as they worked out it was a liability. Turns out that while the law says they can do this, it doesn't mention anything about having no duty of care of other people's property at the same time...

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#22

Post by moolcool »

asdajksah2123 wrote: post #7
candiddevmike wrote: post #2

What was the impetus for schools to become "smartphone-friendly"? In the 00s, phones/smartphones in class weren't a thing.

I suspect they first became mobile phone friendly. Dumbphones provided kids a way to communicate with parents and the worst distraction would be kids wanting to play snake and/or texting little messages to each other on their T9 keyboards. But once smartphones came around they replaced those dumbphones and snuck in through the same policies, but in reality they're a completely different category from dumbphones.

Dumbphones weren't allowed in my high school, but apparently smartphones are now.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#23

Post by com2kid »

cedws wrote: post #10

My schooling experience (in London, less than 10 years ago) was a waste of time. If they want students to be engaged, make the material engaging.

In many developing countries, students pay attention because they want to better themselves in life and they have been taught that working hard in school will get them out of poverty.

Meanwhile the Western countries are wondering why they are being eclipsed in academic performance.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#24

Post by ben_w »

cedws wrote: post #10

My schooling experience (in London, less than 10 years ago) was a waste of time. If they want students to be engaged, make the material engaging.

Valuable and engaging are different things.

I found Duolingo was very engaging. I also found it wildly ineffective at actually teaching me more than the absolute basics of any languages… except Arabic where it didn't even manage that.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#25

Post by ghaff »

Vaguely related: A local theater is making sort of a big deal about sealing phones and smart watches into Yondr pouches for the performance unless you go to an area where phones are allowed. I don't really care but this seems to be a solution to a problem I really haven't observed when attending local theater.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#26

Post by logtempo »

rubymamis wrote: post #3

I believe that, in retrospect, these schoolchildren will greatly appreciate this decision.

To me, the necessity to have a banning "law" is a sign of failure. We should teach children the why and how, incentive them to put, by themselves, their phone in a lockbox and eventually consider them as growing adult and not irresponsible childs.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#27

Post by spenczar5 »

leohonexus wrote: post #9

I was curious about the legal grounds that schools have to confiscate student's phones for up to a week, and I found this document from the UK government: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/62d1643e8fa8f... Some things that concern me: - Page 19: Staff may examine any data or files on an electronic device they have confiscated as a result of a search, as defined in paragraph 57, if there is good reason to…

I am curious whether you are a UK citizen? In general, British law does not protect privacy, and is far less liberal (in the classical sense) than outsiders expect. The bits you cite seem fairly typical for UK expectations and rights.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#28

Post by foldr »

cedws wrote: post #10

My schooling experience (in London, less than 10 years ago) was a waste of time. If they want students to be engaged, make the material engaging.

I'm struggling to imagine how bad a school in the UK would have to be to really be a complete waste of time. For example, there must be some use in learning basic mathematical concepts and having access to someone who can help you when you get stuck on them. If you were just a super bright kid who didn't need any support to learn that stuff then I can see more where you are coming from, but that obviously isn't the typical case.

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#29

Post by trgn »

ben_w wrote: post #18
rubymamis wrote: post #3

I believe that, in retrospect, these schoolchildren will greatly appreciate this decision.

I can see it going either way. A century ago in the US, a lot of support for Prohibition came from the impact of liquor, yet Prohibition itself also banned beer. I can very easily believe that the backlash against dark patterns, against deliberately addictive apps (games and social media), against advertising getting squeezed into what would otherwise be normal conversations, against the surveillance that currently m…

what useful thing does a smartphone do during school hours?

Re: Group of 17 London secondary schools join up to go smartphone-free

#30

Post by jfyi »

wafflemaker wrote: post #8

I know it would complicate things a lot, but are we sure it's smartphones and not social media / "not educational" websites being the issue? If I had a phone with calendar and a to do list, when at school, I might have fared better.

Can we be sure it's social media at all? Or is it a behavior issue? Does it matter if they are watching tiktok or mucking with a calendar if they aren't participating in class?

Enforcement will likely come down to don't do stupid shit with your phone or risk losing it. Ignoring class for a phone is stupid shit regardless of what's on the screen.

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