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The Fall of the House of Etsy

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21–30 of 107 posts

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#21
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where do people actually handmaking stuff sell now?

The real answer is where they always have: local markets and craft fairs. Most towns and cities have some kind of periodic craft market, which is often related to a farmers and/or food market. They usually have some kind of weird schedule like first Sunday of every month or similar. You can also see if your local arts centre/university/whatever has some kind of market. There's also usually different kinds of conventi…

If you enjoy beer basically any brewery is having some sort of makers market / flea market / local artist event on the weekends.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#22
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Enshittification" originally had a very specific definition: > First, they are good to their users; then they abuse their users to make things better for their business customers; finally, they abuse those business customers to claw back all the value for themselves. Then, they die. Nowadays it's just used as a catch-all for "made worse".

Etsy fits Cory's original definition to a tee though.

Maybe, I'm not too familiar with their story. Who were the business users on Etsy?

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#23
post #8

This isn't new. The Regretsy blog extensively complained about dropshippers in 2010. The problem is that operating a two sided marketplace connecting small makers to customers just really sucks as a business. Tons of churn, intractable problems with quality and fulfillment, having to pay for a lot of customer service agents who fundamentally can't solve any problems, since they don't actually work for the person who…

> and nothing to stop them Except Ebay and Amazon already existing.

And Amazon having rather high fees.

Jeff Bezos used to say, "Your margin is my opportunity", but I'm not sure he even cares anymore.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#24
The best version of Etsy is long gone. Hand crafted items from their original source just won't satiate IPO investors. There REALLY needs to spring up a (good) Etsy alternative that's content to be what it is and not an exponential growth machine that poisons the roots they originally built on.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#25

This isn't new. The Regretsy blog extensively complained about dropshippers in 2010. The problem is that operating a two sided marketplace connecting small makers to customers just really sucks as a business. Tons of churn, intractable problems with quality and fulfillment, having to pay for a lot of customer service agents who fundamentally can't solve any problems, since they don't actually work for the person who…

> intractable problems with quality and fulfillment

• Re: fulfillment — why not ask Etsy sellers to pre-stock everything that's not made-to-order into fulfillment centers like Amazon's? And, in fact, to send anything that is made-to-order to a fulfillment center first, where it'll be inspected, re-wrapped and re-shipped by the fulfillment center — with the buyer's card only having a hold, not a charge, on it until the seller's goods are inspected by the fulfillment center as good? (In other words: turn the process into a goods-for-money mediated escrow.)

• Re: quality / drop-shipping — I feel like a lot of this could by solved just through simple semi-automated verification. Require for a product to be listed, for the seller to upload a video of themselves making the thing. Then pass those videos to MTurk workers to evaluate them for tricks.

> Etsy has every reason in the world to want to get away from small sellers and move to high volume manufacturers

Except that... that's their whole niche.

Specifically, 90% of Etsy's value at this point is in the market of buyers they have slowly marketed and engaged and cultivated brand recognition with over decades — and those buyers are people looking for low-volume goods. They don't want to buy high-volume goods from Etsy. That's not the association they've been painstakingly educated to have.

If Etsy wanted to get into Amazon's business, they'd have to create a new brand to do it with, because that's just not the business that people associate with the Etsy brand. And that would mean starting from scratch.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#26

This isn't new. The Regretsy blog extensively complained about dropshippers in 2010. The problem is that operating a two sided marketplace connecting small makers to customers just really sucks as a business. Tons of churn, intractable problems with quality and fulfillment, having to pay for a lot of customer service agents who fundamentally can't solve any problems, since they don't actually work for the person who…

Etsy should charge the sellers fees per sale, and make them post an expensive bond. Then Etsy can ban drop shipping, give instant refunds, pay return postage, and generally hold the creators to high standards.

Etsy should also mandate the inclusion of a scan code in the package, which the customer can use to show they received the shipment but it wasn't as advertised. This would catch people lying about the contents, when the creators take a photo of the item & code in the box (and send it to Etsy before shipping.) Creators taking a photo and then changing the item will be caught because of the number of complaints, and customers can be refunded long after the transactions using the bond.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#27

The automatic enrolment in the Etsy advertising program means the platform fees for anyone selling more than 10k USD increase sharply at that point to ~20% of total revenue. What that means is that any artists/makers that are doing volumes that represent anything even close to a full time wage are totally shafted. If I were an artist selling stuff, I would strongly consider a switch to something like Shopify, especia…

If I were an artist selling stuff on Etsy, my storefront would undergo mitosis under new PO-box identities every time it hit 5k USD of sales.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#28
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where do people actually handmaking stuff sell now?

The real answer is where they always have: local markets and craft fairs. Most towns and cities have some kind of periodic craft market, which is often related to a farmers and/or food market. They usually have some kind of weird schedule like first Sunday of every month or similar. You can also see if your local arts centre/university/whatever has some kind of market. There's also usually different kinds of conventi…

Why are you so sure that an item being sold at a local craft-market gives you any guarantee of its local origin? The "hobbyist jeweler" standing at the twee little booth in the community center on a Saturday afternoon, could just as well have 1000pc boxes of identical "artisanal" rings and pendants from Alibaba sitting under the table, ready to replenish your purchase.

Mind you, you can at least be sure that food items sold by such vendors are domestic (if not local per se), because of import restrictions.

Re: The Fall of the House of Etsy

#30
post #24

The best version of Etsy is long gone. Hand crafted items from their original source just won't satiate IPO investors. There REALLY needs to spring up a (good) Etsy alternative that's content to be what it is and not an exponential growth machine that poisons the roots they originally built on.

>not an exponential growth machine

This is increasingly impossible under capitalism for fundamental reasons, which are illustrated most clearly in modern financialized capitalism by shareholder interests.

Your desires (and mine) will require a reorganization of society as we know it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tendency_of_the_rate_of_prof...

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_accumulation

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