Live data from Hacker News

The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

newyorker.com

21–30 of 53 posts

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#21
post #5
post #2

"Grief, I've learned, is really just love. It's all the love you want to give, but cannot. All that unspent love gathers up in the corners of your eyes, the lump in your throat, and in that hollow part of your chest. Grief is just love with no place to go." Jamie Anderson Felix Revello de Toro - Woman, 1965

This is brilliant. And it also illuminates how it can turn into something deeply maladaptive and self-destructive when we cling too hard to something that's passed or will eventually pass, when we define ourselves too much by that which we love or are loved. It reminds me of all the times when I was young where I thought I was deeply in love, but really I was just in love with the feeling of being loved and accepted.…

Having lost both parents young, all my grandparents and a spouse... years and years ago, and a brother who is alive but is lost to mental torment from fighting his grief... and I'm not even 40 yet.

Calling grief maladaptive seems deeply wrong, while I both grieved and persevered through the loss and have been financially successful and am "well adjusted" and "successful" by any external observers measure, I do not think I would judge myself or anyone else who was pulled into the abyss by grief, I still doubt if living with grief was even the right choice, though I am glad I ended up in a mental state where I retained my volition to make the choice.

Loss is loss, a person who has part of their brain removed, their heart damaged so it barely pumps enough oxygen, their limbs lost or kidneys damaged... their inability to function or find joy, meaning or energy in life would never be judged as maladaptive.

I persist, that is true, but I see no moral or emotional difference between my functioning and if I was non functioning. I so repeatedly see people discount grief, mental trauma and other forms of true tangible loss as if was somehow different from other types of physical loss, but it isn't.

To call it an inability to adapt to loss is one thing, just as a head without a body could not open a door with our current technology, but I would humbly suggest that it is too far too call it maladaptive.

I loved every person I lost, due to my age for my parents I was quite literally dependent on them, and the sheer force of will required and personal self subjugation I cannot clearly say was worth it, After all, I've never met an unhappy, struggling or grief stricken man in the ashes of an urn. Loss is loss, it is as real as a limb or organ lost.

We all have different experiences, but just some thoughts to consider.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#22
post #2

"Grief, I've learned, is really just love. It's all the love you want to give, but cannot. All that unspent love gathers up in the corners of your eyes, the lump in your throat, and in that hollow part of your chest. Grief is just love with no place to go." Jamie Anderson Felix Revello de Toro - Woman, 1965

"It seems to me, that if we love, we grieve. That’s the deal. That’s the pact. Grief and love are forever intertwined. Grief is the terrible reminder of the depths of our love and, like love, grief is non-negotiable." -- Nick Cave, https://www.theredhandfiles.com/communication-dream-feeling/

Never seen this before, as a person who has grieved considerably but won't/doesn't read grief literature.

I came to the conclusion years ago that grief is just unexpressed, unshareable, uncommunicable, thwarted love. It's all the love I cannot give, all the words and touches and moments that fail to alight on the one I love but instead, missing its intended, affix me to the void.

So not merely entwined, I think grief is love itself unsatisfied.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#23

I’ve been lost to grief for the last several months - when I realised, finally, irrevocably, that my wife was never going to recover from the mental straitjacket she is now in. That the woman I married fifteen years ago no longer exists. Backstory: She went to hospital one day in March last year, she had hyponatremia (low sodium) and they gave her saline solution roughly twice as fast as recommended - they wanted to…

I had an experience that lasted for a year before ending (with a bad outcome) that sounds emotionally very similar and I had broken heart syndrome for part of that time.

You two are dealing with a misfortune that is one of the greatest evils that can befall a person.

I'm terribly sorry, words are insufficient I know.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#24

I’ve been lost to grief for the last several months - when I realised, finally, irrevocably, that my wife was never going to recover from the mental straitjacket she is now in. That the woman I married fifteen years ago no longer exists. Backstory: She went to hospital one day in March last year, she had hyponatremia (low sodium) and they gave her saline solution roughly twice as fast as recommended - they wanted to…

Deeply, deeply, deeply understood. And thank you on behalf of life for shouldering what you do, with thanks for telling of it so that I could see in your words that… you already understand. A story untold.

And. For a lack of better words: I am so, so sorry for what you and yours have been through.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#25
I wonder if the reason why some people surround themselves with awful, selfish people is because it makes it easier to grieve them once they leave or pass away.

They'll say all nice things at the funeral but actually it takes no effort to hold back tears. Many people will have the opposite problem; they want to show tears for virtue-signalling purposes but find that they can't.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#26

I wonder if the reason why some people surround themselves with awful, selfish people is because it makes it easier to grieve them once they leave or pass away. They'll say all nice things at the funeral but actually it takes no effort to hold back tears. Many people will have the opposite problem; they want to show tears for virtue-signalling purposes but find that they can't.

That would be a really weird way to actively decide to live one's limited life.

I'd say the reason is that historical relationships and connections are hard to let go and when you do (saying by moving to a new place,) you're left with whatever you end up finding.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#27

I’ve been lost to grief for the last several months - when I realised, finally, irrevocably, that my wife was never going to recover from the mental straitjacket she is now in. That the woman I married fifteen years ago no longer exists. Backstory: She went to hospital one day in March last year, she had hyponatremia (low sodium) and they gave her saline solution roughly twice as fast as recommended - they wanted to…

Maybe you can try alternative medicine like ayurveda. Recently I heard an amazing podcast [0] with Dr. Rakesh in which he talked about regenerating neurons etc with Ayurveda. His contact details are in the video description. 0: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c3UB-HlA7o

I would try anything at this point. Sometimes hope is all you need.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#28
Huberman made a nice episode about grief https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzOvi0Aa2EA

Good quality information in there, saying this after years of trying to overcome a lot of stuff and never really finding anything of value. This was interesting. Hope others find some help in it.

ps: I always assumed that grieving is supposed to be done with others, they buffer the loss, share it with you and make your future make sense because your pain is not unheard and thus your emotional self is somehow intact and allowed to be. Without this you may end up as a fake shell unable to find any form of true connection since you've been alienated at your deepest moments.

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#29

I lost my wife to cancer last year; she was 46. She was my best friend, lover, my son’s mom and one of the greatest people whom I’ve ever known. Q It is a surreal experience. For me it started as shock. I did not eat a meal for almost two months. Lots of people were around and I kept busy doing random things. Then people go away and the random tasks are done, and it’s quiet and strange. I chose to move forward, focus…

Condolences

Re: The Strangeness of Grief (2019)

#30

I lost my wife to cancer last year; she was 46. She was my best friend, lover, my son’s mom and one of the greatest people whom I’ve ever known. Q It is a surreal experience. For me it started as shock. I did not eat a meal for almost two months. Lots of people were around and I kept busy doing random things. Then people go away and the random tasks are done, and it’s quiet and strange. I chose to move forward, focus…

Sorry to hear.

I lost my dad over a decade ago which I was close too, and a couple of years later broke up with my SO which I'd been with for well over a decade at that point.

While nowhere close to your experience, that weird emptyness sounded very familiar. Coming home from work, eating dinner alone and then just "ok, now what?". Suddenly the days seemed to have so many more hours to fill.

And that feeling when you had some fun or nice experience and you just want to share and pick up the phone only to go "oh... right". I still get that with my dad, and it still hits hard.

Post reply on HN