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More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

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Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#21

Post by lupire »

_yb2s wrote: post #11
lupire wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's how it works, in scams and high pressure sales: 1. Victim suspects scam 2. Victim recognizes the presence of predator. 3. Victim gets scared. 4. Victim tried to maintain composure, but can't think of a way to escape the situation without the predator pursuing. 5. Victim appeases predator because they fear all the terrible things this predator might do, as the predator has no morality and the victim's civilizat…

Why would they be afraid of a random stranger on whatsapp?

They don't undertand the technical details. All they know is someone appears able and willing to violate social and legal norms, and was able to make contact. To lizard brain, it can feel like meeting a mugger in a dark alley.

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#22

Post by lupire »

nickff wrote: post #14
varispeed wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also works where police abandoned the victims. They feel they'll have no recourse if scammer escalates and becomes violent, so they rationalise that giving in to the scam will be cheaper and less stressful than going to the police and potentially putting their life at risk.

The police are not there to protect individuals, they’re there to protect the government. This has been made abundantly clear in a number of cases where police have disclaimed any duty to citizens & residents. Given all of that, the victims are reacting appropriately.

More properly, police in US have a duty to society, not to any specific individual. They are law enforcement. Not crime prevention or victim protection.

This is of course a huge problem, because as seen in Uvalde in elsewhere, not only do police have no obligation to help you (which by itself is reasonable of undesirable), but are also empowered to prevent you from helping yourself.

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#23

Post by lupire »

varispeed wrote: post #13
psychlops wrote: post #2

"The fraudsters also registered nearly 100 phone numbers using false identities." Is it really a WhatsApp scheme? I thought the purpose of phone numbers now is to tie them to an actual person.

Where this is more enforced, it's not uncommon for criminals to get homeless or drug addicts to register phones using their identities.

Indeed, poverty engenders crime.

International financial crime would be international economic justice, if only the stolen funds went to poor individuals and not their slaveowners or corporate masters

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#24

Post by prawn »

randycupertino wrote: post #15
_yb2s wrote: post #6

It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I’m also generally leery of people “urgently needing money.” It seems like something a scammer would do, and I couldn’t see any of my family members doing it. Maybe I’m a jerk, but I’d be more…

> It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I think elderly are more vulnerable to this, because they get scared and want to help. My elderly mother fell victim to a "microsoft" and "paypal" technician calling her twice, despite my tra…

A friend's mother fell for one of these largely because she'd contacted her ISP earlier that day about a problem and was expecting a call back. Very unfortunate.

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#25

Post by metalcrow »

_yb2s wrote: post #6

It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I’m also generally leery of people “urgently needing money.” It seems like something a scammer would do, and I couldn’t see any of my family members doing it. Maybe I’m a jerk, but I’d be more…

Sure, you think that, but then the one time it does happen and you don't give them money and someone gets serious hurt or dies, you never forgive yourself ever again. And out of worry that that may happen, a lot of people will be safe rather then sorry. Since money is less important then lives.

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#26

Post by throwitaway222 »

lupire wrote: post #8
_yb2s wrote: post #6

It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I’m also generally leery of people “urgently needing money.” It seems like something a scammer would do, and I couldn’t see any of my family members doing it. Maybe I’m a jerk, but I’d be more…

Here's how it works, in scams and high pressure sales: 1. Victim suspects scam 2. Victim recognizes the presence of predator. 3. Victim gets scared. 4. Victim tried to maintain composure, but can't think of a way to escape the situation without the predator pursuing. 5. Victim appeases predator because they fear all the terrible things this predator might do, as the predator has no morality and the victim's civilizat…

off with their heads

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#27

Post by apantel »

hibikir wrote: post #19
_yb2s wrote: post #6

It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I’m also generally leery of people “urgently needing money.” It seems like something a scammer would do, and I couldn’t see any of my family members doing it. Maybe I’m a jerk, but I’d be more…

There are similar versions of the scam aiming at companies, as the CEO needs money wired to him as part of a secret acquisition of some sort. There's training trying to target this vector specifically, as the amounts are huge, but it also means more efforts can be made to be more realistic: Getting plenty of pictures and entire voice interviews from many CEOs is trivial. You can imagine how hard one can go crafting a…

Yeah with real-time deepfake audio this could be done by an attacker as an actual phone call in the voice of the person being impersonated.

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#29

Post by irjustin »

hibikir wrote: post #19
_yb2s wrote: post #6

It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I’m also generally leery of people “urgently needing money.” It seems like something a scammer would do, and I couldn’t see any of my family members doing it. Maybe I’m a jerk, but I’d be more…

There are similar versions of the scam aiming at companies, as the CEO needs money wired to him as part of a secret acquisition of some sort. There's training trying to target this vector specifically, as the amounts are huge, but it also means more efforts can be made to be more realistic: Getting plenty of pictures and entire voice interviews from many CEOs is trivial. You can imagine how hard one can go crafting a…

We got "attacked" by this. The team was diligent enough to ask questions, but we are a financing company so money transfer requests are extremely common. We had processes in place and obviously made them stricter.

My concern is as AI voice/video generation becomes stronger the social engineering can cause internal processes to be circumvented especially if you have a basic understanding of the inner workings of the org.

Re: More than 100 arrested in Spain in $900k WhatsApp scheme

#30

Post by franciscop »

randycupertino wrote: post #15
_yb2s wrote: post #6

It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I’m also generally leery of people “urgently needing money.” It seems like something a scammer would do, and I couldn’t see any of my family members doing it. Maybe I’m a jerk, but I’d be more…

> It’s hard to understand how someone could fall for this scam… if a loved one was having an emergency of some kind I would expect them to call rather than text, and I would respond with a call either way to discuss the details. I think elderly are more vulnerable to this, because they get scared and want to help. My elderly mother fell victim to a "microsoft" and "paypal" technician calling her twice, despite my tra…

Part of my family training has been "phone numbers can be easily stolen" so be wary of that (okay we know it's not "easy", but they CAN be stolen by a semi-decent cracker calling the ISP and this sentence has already 2 words that would take days to explain to them).
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