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Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

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Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#21

Post by giantg2 »

richardanaya wrote: post #6
MPSimmons wrote: post #3

The Apple watch has a decent cardio fitness monitor. The absolute values aren't precise (since it uses VO2Max estimates, which is really only accurate if you're doing a metabolic stress test), but it's good to keep an eye on trends.

VO2 max is also exercise dependent. If you trained riding bike for 3 months, then went to run down the street, your VO2 max would not transfer over.

VO2 max is a measure of oxygen uptake and distribution. Your VO2 max will transfer over. However, if you're measuring VO2 max in some ancillary way (not a stress test machine) then it will appear differently since you're level of effort will vary based on your technique dor the chosen exercises.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#22

Post by _yb2s »

jacurtis wrote: post #8
thunkle wrote: post #2

So the sicker you are the less in shape you are in? Seems obvious to me.

That's what you hypothesize. Research like this affirms your hypothesis with fact. There are historically lots of things that "seemed obvious" but couldn't hold up under research, which is why we do research. It confirms what you think or maybe it forces you to question what you think. Either way, it is good. Case and point, there is a rising opinion lately which Trump has promoted that your heart only beats a set, f…

I think they were asserting that people are out of shape because they are sick, and that this study does not imply the causality most people would assume: that getting in shape will make you live longer.

The study itself can’t address the direction of causality because it is observational.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#23

Post by BenFranklin100 »

FredPret wrote: post #18
MPSimmons wrote: post #3

The Apple watch has a decent cardio fitness monitor. The absolute values aren't precise (since it uses VO2Max estimates, which is really only accurate if you're doing a metabolic stress test), but it's good to keep an eye on trends.

The poor VO2Max estimates on the Apple Watch is why I'm phasing out of wearing one. I track my actual VO2Max measurements in Apple Health via a shortcut, and I don't need a daily made-up number messing up my data.

As the OP mentioned, absolute numbers are garbage, but trends are useful. Once a year just get an actual VO2Max test to peg the watch values too.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#24

Post by verst »

richardanaya wrote: post #6
MPSimmons wrote: post #3

The Apple watch has a decent cardio fitness monitor. The absolute values aren't precise (since it uses VO2Max estimates, which is really only accurate if you're doing a metabolic stress test), but it's good to keep an eye on trends.

VO2 max is also exercise dependent. If you trained riding bike for 3 months, then went to run down the street, your VO2 max would not transfer over.

My VO2 max from running definitely transfers to cycling. Doesn't mean I'm an amazing cyclist but at least cardio isn't my limiting factor.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#25

Post by richardanaya »

basil-rash wrote: post #7
richardanaya wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VO2 max is also exercise dependent. If you trained riding bike for 3 months, then went to run down the street, your VO2 max would not transfer over.

Is that true? Back when I was a crew gremlin, my VO2 max as measured via erging was off the charts. But I could apply that cardio capacity to things like running/biking/swimming pretty effectively.

There's famous studies about people testing VO2 max with one leg trained exercises,then looking at VO2 max with non-trained leg.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1748-1716.1976...

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#26

Post by timack »

jacurtis wrote: post #8
thunkle wrote: post #2

So the sicker you are the less in shape you are in? Seems obvious to me.

That's what you hypothesize. Research like this affirms your hypothesis with fact. There are historically lots of things that "seemed obvious" but couldn't hold up under research, which is why we do research. It confirms what you think or maybe it forces you to question what you think. Either way, it is good. Case and point, there is a rising opinion lately which Trump has promoted that your heart only beats a set, f…

Surely the number of beats of a higher heart rate while exercising would be more than offset by the lower resting heart rate of a fitter person?

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#27

Post by ssgodderidge »

FredPret wrote: post #18
MPSimmons wrote: post #3

The Apple watch has a decent cardio fitness monitor. The absolute values aren't precise (since it uses VO2Max estimates, which is really only accurate if you're doing a metabolic stress test), but it's good to keep an eye on trends.

The poor VO2Max estimates on the Apple Watch is why I'm phasing out of wearing one. I track my actual VO2Max measurements in Apple Health via a shortcut, and I don't need a daily made-up number messing up my data.

I would love to see how this works. Where can I learn more? I’ve been pretty dissatisfied with the VO2Max on the watch overall.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#28

Post by busymom0 »

kelipso wrote: post #13
busymom0 wrote: post #4

Slightly related: I have been engaging in powerlifting/weightlifting for over a decade. In my initial years, I was in the "just do weights, don't need cardio" camp. However, around 2018, I started doing cardio mostly to cut body weight as I wanted to hit my personal bests on squats, deadlifts, and bench at a lower body weight. I personally experienced that my weights moved much better, especially when I was doing mor…

I see a similar effect too. I usually do just lifting but I recently started doing a bit of cardio (rowing and that resistance treadmill thing) and it improved my lifting even at 5 reps. Granted my cardio was pretty bad but I felt more steady and felt like I could do more volume.

Completely anecdotal but I think cardio of High-Intensity Interval Training (HIIT) type transfers over the best to weight lifting. I am going to guess it has something to do with the intense/explosive intervals in cardio making one more used to similar explosiveness on weights.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#29

Post by analog31 »

busymom0 wrote: post #4

Slightly related: I have been engaging in powerlifting/weightlifting for over a decade. In my initial years, I was in the "just do weights, don't need cardio" camp. However, around 2018, I started doing cardio mostly to cut body weight as I wanted to hit my personal bests on squats, deadlifts, and bench at a lower body weight. I personally experienced that my weights moved much better, especially when I was doing mor…

One of my few regrets in life, and something I advise to all younger people, is that I didn't work on my upper body strength when I was younger. Now I'm 60, and it's going to be essentially a battle against muscle loss.

So I suppose the message needs to be: Both are important.

Re: Cardio fitness is a strong, consistent predictor of morbidity and mortality

#30

Post by swatcoder »

BenFranklin100 wrote: post #17

I am disappointed by how poor primary care is in the developed world. It could easily be made better by including a VO2Max test and a DEXA scan every few years. On my own dime, I took both (cost was ~ $150 total from a private provider) and the DEXA scan revealed I carried too much visceral fat and my cardiovascular fitness was only average, things that never came up in my yearly physical. The same applies for basic…

For better or worse (worse), people don't go to the doctor for lifestyle analysis and rarely take lifestyle advice from their doctors.

They go to their doctors to know when to start medical interventions.

Even simple waist-to-hip ratio assessement would be a big win for identifying lifestyle concerns, but neither that nor the far more involved VO2Max and DEXA rests are going to become standard unless they becoming a gaiting condition for some celebrated drug or procedure.

And that's as much because of the patient's perspective of what they want from doctors as it is because of the doctors or broader establishment.

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