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Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

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Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#21
1) A big reason why Facebook was not excited to IPO.

2) Facebook probably doesn't care that much since it got its money at very rich valuation and now can just go about its business (ideally the lawyers will handle all this with minimal distraction to the company).

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#23
post #3

Do lawsuits like this happen often for IPOs? Or is this something unusual?

Thinking about this for a moment, what conceivable reason could someone have to sue with billions of dollars on the line?

You do the math.

Or search through some IPO history.

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#24
post #20
post #14

Here's the facts: the information upon which analysts reduced their estimates was publicly available. There was no secret, insider information. It was based on FB filings with the SEC. Failing to research a stock before investing is just dumb to the point where plaintiff's really should, by natural consequence, lose. If losses are always recoverable via lawsuit or government bailout, all we do is perpetuate such gamb…

Not stating an opinion either way, but describing what the lawsuit is actually about here. Morgan Stanley's analyst, Scott Devitt, adjusted their estimates and they then gave that information to high-end MS customers, but not to the public. The question is whether or not MS has a responsibility as an underwriter to disclose that information to an audience broader than its own clients as material information about the…

"The question is whether or not MS has a responsibility as an underwriter to disclose that information to an audience broader than its own clients"

That is an interesting question and will be a good suit to watch. If the finding is that there was a responsibility to broadly disseminate such information, it will also be interesting to see what the impact is to the financial advisory industry.

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#26
This whole Facebook IPO has got to be the worst I have ever seen traders whine and the market be irrational. 90+ P/E is okay, but new projections scare you?? Really?? They are projections!! I project I will make 10 billion dollars next year, buy stock in me!

This IPO was perfect from Facebook and intial investors perspective, it shows they priced the IPO to extract maximum value (they didn't lose any value to market traders via a "healthy POP").

Traders obviously placed the wrong bet, boo hoo, suck it up. You can't win on every trade. You think they'd know that by now.

This whole "I bought a sure thing that wasn't and someone else must pick up the tab" mentality is crap and must be stopped. I hope they lose this suit, or at the very most get pennies on the dollar.

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#27
post #14

Here's the facts: the information upon which analysts reduced their estimates was publicly available. There was no secret, insider information. It was based on FB filings with the SEC. Failing to research a stock before investing is just dumb to the point where plaintiff's really should, by natural consequence, lose. If losses are always recoverable via lawsuit or government bailout, all we do is perpetuate such gamb…

While your last two paragraphs are true, it's not clear they apply to this case. What is clear is that some folks have some very wishful thinking with regard to Facebook, the company. Ask yourself why.

No matter what you may think of FB, it is going to come down to the actions of the FB execs. If they knowingly tried to mislead common investors, then common investors are certainly not to blame.

Meanwhile, the FB stock is becoming a pariah.

So even if they have some valid reason for changing their estimates days before the IPO, and they can explain why the insiders were the only ones who seemed to get the message, it may be a moot point. Because they have spooked investors.

And it's a stretch to try to blame investors for being spooked.

The victim here is actually FB.

The end of FB, and its replacement with a private and optimised means of sharing that _you_ control, is the beginning of a better web.

It may not be Diaspora. There is still lots of time for this to play out.

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#28
post #24
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not stating an opinion either way, but describing what the lawsuit is actually about here. Morgan Stanley's analyst, Scott Devitt, adjusted their estimates and they then gave that information to high-end MS customers, but not to the public. The question is whether or not MS has a responsibility as an underwriter to disclose that information to an audience broader than its own clients as material information about the…

"The question is whether or not MS has a responsibility as an underwriter to disclose that information to an audience broader than its own clients" That is an interesting question and will be a good suit to watch. If the finding is that there was a responsibility to broadly disseminate such information, it will also be interesting to see what the impact is to the financial advisory industry.

What concerns me more than public dissemination of analysis would be the instance of them only disseminating negative information to a select group of their own clients, while leaving their other mom and pop clients in the dark.

That would seem to be a clear violation of fiduciary duty, and if it turns out that's what they did, I hope they get the book thrown at them.

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#29
post #20
post #14

Here's the facts: the information upon which analysts reduced their estimates was publicly available. There was no secret, insider information. It was based on FB filings with the SEC. Failing to research a stock before investing is just dumb to the point where plaintiff's really should, by natural consequence, lose. If losses are always recoverable via lawsuit or government bailout, all we do is perpetuate such gamb…

Not stating an opinion either way, but describing what the lawsuit is actually about here. Morgan Stanley's analyst, Scott Devitt, adjusted their estimates and they then gave that information to high-end MS customers, but not to the public. The question is whether or not MS has a responsibility as an underwriter to disclose that information to an audience broader than its own clients as material information about the…

They don't, there are chinese walls in between the analysis and trading groups. Research is a product most banks sell, if you don't purchase it, you don't get it.

Re: Morgan Stanley, Goldman Sachs Sued Over Facebook IPO

#30
post #17

I don't understand this. Selective dissemination of actual business data - fine, sue their asses. But projections are guesses - guesses without any guarantees. Facebook could magically rake in a billion tomorrow, or completely shut down - "projections" aside. Why is it that there's a legal recourse because the projections person X got were different from what person Y got?

Because the stock price people are asked to pay at an IPO (or at any time) is based primarily on projections.

So, 'Mom and Pop' got projections A which made $38 sound like a reasonable price, whereas the big boys got projections B which told them to wait till the price settles on $10.

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